DIY Question about building a Hearth

[bonniethomas06]

Hi,

Sorry, not really to do with ishiness (well, sort of as it is to do with installing a wood burning stove hearth!) but I have run out of people to ask and my dad is useless at this kind of thing!

Following the earlier thread about flues and woodburners, I am installing ours this weekend. I need to tile the hearth in readiness. I have chosen some natural slate tiles, but need to stick them to the concrete floor.

I cannot work out:

a) Will adhesive work which is suitable for use with underfloor heating? (i.e not flame proof but presumably ok to get hot - I can't find any tile adhesive for use in fireplaces - I guess it will not come into direct contact with heat as there will be a thick quarry tile on top?; and

b) I know I can't use ordinary grout as it will crack (this IS in direct contact with the stove heat) but I can't find any fire-proof grout - can I use fire cement instead of grout?

Any help would be much appreciated. I suppose we won't be walking over it, and the tiles will be contained by a wooden boarder, so perhaps the adhesive is not that crucial?

Thanks in advance to any DIY sages out there. The man in the orange and white DIY shop was clueless

[Green Aura]

The man in the orange and white DIY shop was clueless I'm afraid that's often been my experience too. Can't help I'm afraid - where did you get your woodburner from? Maybe they could offer advice.

[Odsox]

Doesn't your wood burner have legs ?
I thought all of them did, in which case very little heat goes down onto the hearth, especially as heat naturally rises so will only be warmed by radiation, and the underside of a wood burner is usually insulated with ash as well.

I raised my hearth, or to be precise I built a plinth for the fire to stand on and used regular sand & cement. I used 4" concrete blocks laying flat with slate slabs on top to raise it all by about six inches.

It's been like that now for about 6 years with no problems.

[grahamhobbs]

Bonnie, there is a heat resistant adhesive, Vitcas Heat Resistant Tile Adhesive. However how hot are the tiles going to get? Has the person supplying the stove suggested that this is necessary?

[oldjerry]

Ditto the above,did the same,but with 3 by 2 slabs laid flat and level,then skimmed with 3 to 1 mortar and thinnish slate laid in this and pointed with left over mortar.Just make sure your base is absolutely level.

[bonniethomas06]

Hi all,

Thanks - yes the stove does have feet, so I can't see how the tiles will get that hot.

We aren't raising it at all - it is just a case of laying the tiles straight onto the concrete floor, so the base of the burner will be suspended about five inches above the tiles, taking account of the feet.

I think I will just proceed with the normal adhesive -I bought the stove online, so no after-service so to speak (on fleabay).

Thanks for your advice.

Bonnie x

[KathyLauren]

I think the normal adhesive for slate tiles is thin-set mortar. It will have no problem with the heat. Then grout between the tiles with sanded grout.

[happy place]

i would suggest using fire cement but then i rebuilt a fire place and hearth in my old housewith engineers bricks (if my foggy memory is right ) and ordinary cement and that worked fine
so i cant see any problem setting your tiles on to cement with cement grout
if you wanted coluored grout you can buy additives but i think food colouring does the job so have fun
good luck

[jim]

So far I've installed two wood burners. In each case I made a level base with concrete, skimmed with self levelling cement [not really necessary] and then used ordinary grout to hold the slate tiles. Made a wooden surround to hide the concrete and placed the burner on top. Eight years on and no problem yet!

Love and Peace
Jim

[bonniethomas06]

Thanks all, I feel much better about it now. I will tile the hearth this evening so that the tiles will be set by the morning.

Not looking forward to the installation - we are not really DIY people. OH is going up the 30ft ladder and I just pray that the flipping liner goes down the chimney without too many problems! Some have said it slid down in 5 mins, others have discovered kinks and jagged edges and it has been a nightmare.

Still, must just remember the £1300 we would have had to pay the chimney man to do it!!!

[oldfella]

Are you putting in a stainless steel liner if so, you say the OH is putting the liner down the chimney when you will find it easier to put in from the bottom, and if you are using the flexible type then he should drop a line down the chimney, and pull it up and then fix it at the top leaving the top of the liner 40cm lower inside the chimney and secure it at the top using galvanised wire. The reason you leave it below the top is that the heat in the chimney rises and increases the draw of the flue.
I have put in four flue liners over the years and so far we have never had a problem,



"Untill of course tomorrow" Sods Law

[bonniethomas06]

Thanks Oldfella, I will mention to him about not putting the liner all the way up to the top. Although we did buy a suspended cowl, so that we can basically just slip it into the pot without having to do proper building stuff like.

I have done a lot of reading, but eveyone so far has said to pull it down from the top, as if there is loose lining and debris in the existing flue (which I think there is, as ours is very old), this can get dragged up the chimney with the pulling of the liner, and could tear it/make it difficult to do.

What do you think? I would much prefer to pull from the top than have poor OH dangling off the chimney (did you use scaffolding, or a ladder?) but don't want to bugger the liner up as it was quite expensive.

[pelmetman]

I put this in myself, it sits on a 6"concrete block which I cast in situ as the floor is timber, and tiled using ordinary adhesive and grout, seems ok 3 years on

christmas 2009 020.JPG (39.01 KiB) Viewed 11762 times

[oldfella]

If you are putting in the flexi tube I think the OH will find it near impossible to push the tube down the chimney and hang onto the chimney at the same time. It depends , can you see up the chimney if so can you see any obstructions, if not get a rope tie a weight on end and bundle up some old heavy rags and lower that down the chimney and drag it back up a few times that gets rid of any loose stuff.
With regards to your question about Scaffold or Ladder, I can't answer, it depends on your other half but obviously scaffold is by far the safest but I have used both, BUT I always tie myself to chimney, and I also tie the ladder in at the top, as many years ago, I heard noises in the night, coming from up on high, and found "shall we say a gentleman" whose TV aerial had moved, went out in the dark in slippers and vest, and went on the roof, slipped, knocked the ladder down and fell back on his ar""se and all this at 10;30pm, in September. Sorry I digress, but take care and let us know how you get on.

Good luck and many happy hours in front a nice blazing fire,


"Whatever you may do in front of the fire"

[bonniethomas06]

AArgh! I am NEVER doing this again.

We got the liner down the chimney, after much swearing and improvisation with nylon rope climbing gear. That was the easy part.

I will give a progress report later for anyone interested, but while the fire cement is still wet, can anyone tell me - where you fit a liner into your chimney and connect it to the logburner (with the aid of meteres of poxy fire rope and lots of fire cement), does the register plate have to be airtight?

Cos ours aint. But so far as I can tell this is only an issue if your logburner is going into the chimney where there is an existing clay liner - otherwise I think the register plat is just to stop debris from falling down the chimney/heat loss?

Thanks and sorry to ask so many questions.