MMR Vaccination

[baldowrie]

my son takes 1000mg 3 x a day, more if he needs it. Yes that's a lot. But that level keeps him on the 'level'. You need to find the dose correct for each individual, you can not over dose on them as the body flushes any it does not use.

You can get capsules or flavoured liquid. I am lucky my son likes the taste

But with all these things they don't work for every one and I would never try and force is down any ones neck..case of suck it and see. Be aware that if starting a course you may get instant results, we did, or it ma take a few weeks at a higher dose then drop it to a dose you experimentally find that suits.

I buy mine from an ebay supplier that I trust and have used for 2 years. If you want the information PM me and I will send it.

[caithnesscrofter]

http://www.vaccination.co.uk/ is quite good

My son had all the vaccinations as I believed I didn't have a choice. when my daughter was a baby I was learning different so she had the first 3 and thats all, baby will be having none. I'm not happy about how they work or whats in some of them so feel it's safer not to have them as there's no turning back. I do feel really bad about the vaccines my children have had, but angry too - I thought I was doing what was best for them but was mislead my son has adhd and though logically I know the 2 are almost definatly not connected, particulally as his dad and most likely his grandad have it too so to me that suggests some genetic link. that nagging feeling that he may of been ok without the vaccines will always be there

I understand your frustration! About the ADHD.... contrary to popular belief there are very few genetic conditions and diseases. A red flag goes up for me when scientists and doctors conclude something must be genetic when they do not even know what 90% of the DNA is. They call it junk DNA!?! Alot of times why things seem genetic are merely only because all the family members are living in the same environment, eating the same diet and have a similiar lifestyle as their other family members and have done so right on down through the generations of the family. This I know has been proven in alot of cases. Another quite interesting thing I heard the other day about ADHD is that it may have something to do with certain peoples reaction to how the brain processes information.. 32 frames per second is as fast as we can go... but, some people compute information through images (the instinctive way) and some people compute verbally or with sounds as they develop. And there is a disorientation in this change of process causing a whole spectrum of symptoms that are "abnormal"... and could include dyslexia, ADD, ADHD, autism and many others. My take on his view is that autism is not a product of vaccines but, is actually evolution taking place before our eyes, socalled "normal" people just do not understand their way of thinking and intellect. My interest in the Mayan Calendar would also suit this thinking, so makes a bit of sense to me. This bloke described it as something like when you're a baby.. you gradually become aware of things around you and as you become more aware.. you become motivated to go and explore things physically therefore you start to crawl and eventually walk. Some people on the other hand have the ability to explore objects better with their mind and can literally "see around corners" and therefore may be very late in development because of lack of motivation to physically explore something when they have already fully explored it with the mind. This same guy also reckons that intellect is purely based on identity. That intellect is a reflection of identity. The stronger a persons identity the more intellect they display. Quite fascinating really. This bloke was once "autistic" and never even spoke till he was seventeen and was quite severely autistic. At 19 though he was teaching calculus to engineers in the US space program. He currently has developed the only system known to help people diagnosed as autistic and/or dyslexic. His name is Ron Davis I believe if anyone is interested.

I have read simular about adhd etc but to be honest I really don't know what to think. I just manage it by doing what works for my son, which has included cutting out additives, keeping his enviroment as free of chemicals as possible (cleaners/air freshener etc etc...)and when he was younger he took a homeopathic remedy for about a year. He has changed from almost being expelled from school at 6 t being on a program for gifted children! of course he still has problems with it sometimes but is doing so well.
I have so read some pieces about children suffering from these conditions being of a higher intellect, not that the rest of us are thick but they have gone to another level that we won't and can't understand and so label as defective in some way. We certain do learn in different ways and have different types of intelligence - I can see that with my own family. My son and his dad are good at 'book stuff' they are good spellers, at maths, science, understanding how things works, enginnering etc etc but my daughter and I aren't so good at that but seem to have a natural ability with plants, animals and more the natural/spiritual world in general.

I spent a huge amount of time researching for my son, I didn't want him on drugs and I was sure there had to be another way and answers I wasn't getting from doctors etc too and really got interested in it all. I start my degree in feb with biological psychology which I am really looking forward to and maybe I'll get further answers too

2steps.. I think you've hit the nail bang on the head! If I could recommend a book I think you might be very interested in. He is one of my favourite authors and speakers. His name is Dr. John Breeding. In fact seeing you are going into biopsychiatry I'll recommend two books of his... The wildest colts make the best horses & The necessity of madness. His other book about Great misunderstandings of children is a quick and interesting read too. The necessity of madness is all about biopsychiatry and it made so much sense to me I read it in 2 days. http://www.wildestcolts.com I can also upload an interview with Gwen Olson author of Confessions of an RX drug pusher. She speaks about the relationship of big pharma and biopsychiatry. Let me know if you would like it.

[caithnesscrofter]

if you're exploring every avenue, I'd suggest seeking out a proper traditional acupuncturist (not the NHS sort) - they have a whole different "model" for how we work, over the years I've seen them work "miracles" many times.
Bear with the strange language - if you read into it, it makes so much sense!
- they talk about energy flows, "blockages", and use points with odd names like "leg three mile", "servant's aide", and offer treatments like "the 7 dragons"
Just because "conventional" medicine offfers neither cure nor explanation doesn't mean that they don't exist! Drug therapy is but a mere stripling of a century or two, acupuncture is the result of 6,000 years of clinical observation!

my father was a chiropractor for 40 years.. just retired and he studied acupuncture and was certified but, never practised it. I think his thoughts is that chiropractic care only corrects over or repetitive use of the body in foreign positions and even correcting subluxations in the spine relieves the physical symptoms but, can only complement nutrition therapy. He firmly does not believe in vaccines of any sort. Acupuncture might have been used and observed for 6,000 years but, humans got this far because of the foods that they eat. Herbal medicine & homeopathy is only an extension of this. Reincorporating plant products & minerals into the system that are supposed to be there in the first place. The Hunzas are a good example of this. Hunzas know no disease and regularly live to 100-120 years old. I too believe food is the first place to start with any ailment. I don't have a perfect diet.. but, am working on it. But, all the people here on this messageboard are all going in the right direction with exploring wild food and organic homegrown foods.

[2steps]

thank you. they do sound interesting :) I found a website about adhd that had a list of famous or very succesful people who have been diagnoised with or are thought to have had adhd which I thought was really nice and positive for kids to see. fits totally with 'wildest colts make the best horses' the links is http://www.becalmd.biz/5495/famous.htm if anyone would like a look. I will certainly look up those books too

[caithnesscrofter]

just found a video on vaccination I saw a few years ago.. is pretty good and it is free to watch here... http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?doc ... accination

[hedgewizard]

Gosh, there's so much disinformation on this thread now that it makes my teeth hurt. I'm not going to offer any advice 'cos no-one's asked, but can I just suggest people reference any claims that they make? Anyone looking on here for information is going to be thoroughly confused!

[caithnesscrofter]

in my view the only disinformation we are recieving is from the NHS and the pharmaceutical companies. There have been outbreaks of measles, whooping cough, mumps and others all over the world in places where the vast majority of the population are vaccinated. hedgewizard, you have already told us that autism is NOT linked to the MMR. If you are so sure then I assume you can tell us the cause of the sharp rise in autism cases then?

I don't know if it is linked.. but, I do know that it is really only part of the issue.. because autism you can see with your eyes in a child. There are though several other serious side effects you can not see with the eyes. You cannot sensibly conclude that because it has been proven in your mind that MMR does not cause autism that the MMR is completely safe can you?

So far, I cannot find one study that says aluminium or formeldehyde are good for my child. Nor have I ever found anything positive about injecting foreign proteins into the bloodstream. When I do.. I'll get her the MMR.

[hedgewizard]

Hi Caithness. I wasn't referring to you specifically, but since you're here let me just pluck out a bit from one of your posts that catches my eye. I should mention that I'm a pharmacist, I think it's only fair. However, being self-employed I'm not in the pay of any of the pharmaceutical companies, and I'd angrily refute any claim that it's in my vested interest to promote medicine use. Quite the reverse, actually, since I spend a great deal of my time trying to stop people taking unnecessary medication, and trying to stop doctors from giving it to them.

Why is it that vaccinations are supposed to work by introducing the antibodies of the disease so, that you are then immune from catching that disease but, people who are HIV positive.. positive for the HIV antibodies will eventually die from AIDS? It's the first time ever in scientific history that having the antibodies of a disease is a bad thing! They can't answer that one.

Actually, you don't introduce antibodies. You introduce antigens, which cause the body to produce its own antibodies. You have to do this before exposure to the infection, otherwise it can't work. I hope that helps.

Please look up how polio is not eradicated. They have simply changed the diagnostic formula. Polio is simply just called something else now.... aseptic or viral meningitis.

Again, polio (actually called anterior poliomyelitis) is caused by a tiny RNA virus called a picornavirus and doesn't feature meningitis at all, but myelitis. Aseptic/viral meningitis is usually a mild and self-limiting infection lasting around seven days, and doesn't usually need any treatment although it can turn very nasty.

Everyone is of course entitled to their own opinions about vaccination; however, I can't help thinking that this whole thread could only be possible in a society where children don't routinely die of these preventable diseases. Although with herd immunity falling, that may soon change.

As for your assumption that I can tell you the cause of the "sharp rise" in autism cases, I'm afraid not. Most of it is due to better diagnosis and improved reporting. There may also be an actual rise in figures, but as yet figures are too sparse to tell and further research is needed.

Since I asked others to reference their claims, I'll do so too. The information on autistic spectrum disorder is from http://www.autism.org.uk, the National Autistic Society. The more general stuff on vaccination, poliomyelitis and meningitis is from my own training, but the information is readily available on any medical site that isn't trying to sell you something, NHS direct, or even the wiki.

[caithnesscrofter]

i didn't think you were referring to me. It seems everyone posting has a different view in some way. However, you are a pharmacist. Surely, you know better than most it's not a great idea to pump aluminium & formeldehyde and excitotoxins into the bloodstream. And, previously, thimerosol.

I think it is also only fair to also mention that while you may not still get paid by the pharmaceutical companies.. you are still peddling their drugs and are educated from material compiled by scientists, doctors, professors and researchers in the pharma/industrial complex. Do you have any examples of the drugs you are trying to get people off and what are examples of drugs you are trying to get doctors to stop giving?

Secondly, my argument about about measles is that it was on a huge decrease when the vaccine was introduced. And people who do get vaccinated still get measles anyways. So, the efficacy is completely debatable up one side and down the other. My other problem is measles is the most dangerous to children under one, am I correct? The MMR cannot be given before then anyways. Measles kills the young, malnourished, Vitamin A deficient and those suffering from other dis ease. Also, after contracting measles, you are less likely to suffer from numerous conditions such as certain tumours, eczema and many others.

As for Rubella... I don't believe my child should have to be immunised for Rubella. We all know it is dangerous to unborn children. This immunisation should be part of a planned parenthood program.. not forced on the whole population as you've got more chance of getting hit by a bus than dying or having complications from german measles.

Children do die of preventable diseases everyday in this country and your inference that we are being arrogant in questioning vaccines because you claim that children don't die of preventable of diseases here everyday is the prime example of why I don't trust those in your field. And I could move on to SIDS. A german girl I know just suffered the loss of her baby girl to sids 30 hours after her first vaccination. When you research the studies done on infants respiratory rates before and after vaccination the results are quite alarming frankly. I believe in Japan they stopped using certain vaccinations (DPT i believe) and in the time that they stopped the vaccines... the sids rate dropped right off the chart. In fact I believe before the cessation of the DPT Japan was like 20th in the world in infant mortality... and dropped to the lowest in the world! When they started the vaccines up again.. they started shooting back up the chart.

I think you ought to read the history of diagnosis of poliovirus. And just because you get polio does not mean you are going to become paralyzed from it, there are milder forms.. aseptic/viral meningitis. For example the new diagnosis claims that suspected polio is considered polio if you are paralyzed 60 days after the first sign of symptoms. When in fact, paralysis from polio happens in the first few days. There is also proof that in recent polio outbreaks around the world.. it has happened to children soon after they had other vaccines which broke down the immune system making them more susceptible to poliovirus.

Can you speak to the antigenic complex? I've tried to get answers.. but, have failed to do so from everyone I ask which says alot in my book. Perhaps, you can explain why the presence of antibodies for measles is a good thing whilst the presence of antibodies of HIV means almost certain death?

[2steps]

As for Rubella... I don't believe my child should have to be immunised for Rubella. We all know it is dangerous to unborn children. This immunisation should be part of a planned parenthood program.. not forced on the whole population as you've got more chance of getting hit by a bus than dying or having complications from german measles.

nut what would then happen to people who fall pregnant unexpectedly or like myself - just 2 weeks after coming of the pill? If I hadn't of had it when I was younger, could I of organised it within those 2 weeks? especially considering I never expected it to happen so fast - took a year with my daughter and I certainly wouldn't want the vaccination while pregnant but there is no way I could insure I wouldn't come into contact with rubella so I'm in a no win situation - either way I risk hurting my baby

[chadspad]

And arent the odds of dying from german measles going to increase as less and less children are immunised against it and it becomes a common disease again?

[caithnesscrofter]

anyone that is pregnant is in a no win situation because pregnant women are in danger if they catch anything simply because no medications for anything are safe while pregnant. so, should children get vaccinated for absolutely everything? I don't believe so. and no, I don't believe you should get the immunisation for rubella for something like 28 days before conception. my point is people need to take responsibility for their own health. also, german measles was on the decrease when the vaccine was introduced in the late 60's early 70's... so, efficacy is in question again. and then we look at the ingredients... gives me shivers.

[chadspad]

I have recently taken my son for his 2nd jab, after lots of question asking and starting this thread in the first place. My last questions were to the Doctor himself and he did set my mind at rest (I know youre probably gonna say he has to say those things but doctors here dont tend to be led like those in the UK). He is totally against giving out Hep.B. jabs just for the sake of it and refuses to give this to children unless they are at high risk. He has heard nothing bad whatsoever about the MMR jab in France and there is a 100% take-up of the vaccination, he says it isnt really an option. Most of the schools wont allow children in without their vaccinations upto date and they have some of the jabs even earlier here than UK for when they start playschool.

[caithnesscrofter]

And arent the odds of dying from german measles going to increase as less and less children are immunised against it and it becomes a common disease again?

there is no solid proof that the vaccine works. the vaccine has also not been in use long enough to know the real effects on the body of the ingredients in the vaccine. ingredients of the MMR II is here. http://emc.medicines.org.uk/emc/assets/ ... ntid=17514

[chadspad]

It says in that report that the odds of something serious happening are 6 to 22 times higher from contracting measles than from having the jab. The a good point for the jab in my opinion. Yes there are nasty things in the vaccine but seems the disease is worse. Not so long ago there was a lad in the UK died from measles because he hadnt had the jab. I understand what some of you are saying about having a good diet etc is important, I agree - I am a Reiki practionner and know the benefits of alternative medicines - but how can a diet and holisyic living prevent a child from catching a virus?