We looked at (3) more properties this weekend, two 60 acres parcels and one 80 acre parcel.
The first 60 acres shared a fence with a neighboring 60 acres we have nick named the "Dead Cow Farm" - while touring that land a month or so ago we found about 9 dead cattle carcases. This new 60 acres was used for cattle and pigs and had a variety of buildings on it - none of which particularly attracted us. It was pricey too.
The next 60 acres was only about a quarter mile down the road. Nothing special and about half in row crops (corn this season). I've sharecropped land before and don't want to do so again. You don't make much money, and your land is tied up preventing you from doing anything with it.
The last 80 acre parcel was about half row crops. Basically flat with a small house. Nothing striking.
We are considering offering a bit more on the 34.5 acre parcel. We have also asked our Realtor to approach the adjoining landowner and see if he/she would be willing to sell us a few acres. There is a wet-weather creek that crosses one corner of our property. I think it would be nice if we could make that creek the southern border instead of a line on the map. Not sure exactly how it runs - asked our agent to figure that out and base the request on the creek if practical (e.g. it added 5-15 acres or so).
Cheers!
Kevin[/b]
Kevin Carpenter Introduction
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kevinc_63366
- margo - newbie
- Posts: 18
- Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 9:39 pm
Having conversations with home builders in parallel. We explored some "random log" homes and had concerns with their engineering. Then we set our sights on a "Timber Frame" home until we got back some cost estimates. Currently we are talking with Chris from biglogs.com about a custom log home. He claims the end cost is about the same as a conventional custom home, but we are pursuing that in more detail.
I'd really like to build something that would be good for generations. Most "stick homes" have an estimated lifetime of about 50 years - thats not good enough. The thermal mass associated with a log home tends to make them very energy efficient, and biglogs uses managed forest lumber without seams (they can provide 12-14" round logs up to 60 feet long - so a wall layer can all be one log).
Oh, this ties into "sustainability" in terms of material - wood is a sustainable product. Having log walls implies no fiberglass, plastic wrap, or anything similar as well - although the roof may be of conventional material, we will probably go with metal coverings. I have brochures about aluminum roofing that comes with a lifetime warranty, and various coated steel roofs are good for up to 50 years. BTW, the aluminum roofs are made from something like 99% consumer recycled material.
Anyhow, just broached the concept of building the home in phases to biglogs (phase 1: Main house; phase 2: Porches; phase 3: Huge Sunroom for solar heating; phase 4: garage). It will be interesting to see how they respond, given the desire to stretch the phases out over a decade or so (possibly allowing me not to have to finance them).
Cheers!
Kevin
I'd really like to build something that would be good for generations. Most "stick homes" have an estimated lifetime of about 50 years - thats not good enough. The thermal mass associated with a log home tends to make them very energy efficient, and biglogs uses managed forest lumber without seams (they can provide 12-14" round logs up to 60 feet long - so a wall layer can all be one log).
Oh, this ties into "sustainability" in terms of material - wood is a sustainable product. Having log walls implies no fiberglass, plastic wrap, or anything similar as well - although the roof may be of conventional material, we will probably go with metal coverings. I have brochures about aluminum roofing that comes with a lifetime warranty, and various coated steel roofs are good for up to 50 years. BTW, the aluminum roofs are made from something like 99% consumer recycled material.
Anyhow, just broached the concept of building the home in phases to biglogs (phase 1: Main house; phase 2: Porches; phase 3: Huge Sunroom for solar heating; phase 4: garage). It will be interesting to see how they respond, given the desire to stretch the phases out over a decade or so (possibly allowing me not to have to finance them).
Cheers!
Kevin
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kevinc_63366
- margo - newbie
- Posts: 18
- Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 9:39 pm
Trying again
Wife and I had a long talk, and decided to make another offer on the 34.76 acre lot. The last round ended with us offering about $2750/acre, they countered at $3250/acre, we declined. This time we have made a "Best & Final" offer of $3000/acre, no conditions, entire cost to be deposited with the title company upon acceptance. e.g. This will be a cash deal and we have the cash - they don't need to worry about any financing falling though.
We like the remoteness (nice dark skies for Astronomy viewing, and VERY quiet), and not going into debt to buy it. Indeed, we suspect using the financing we had considered for the 80 acre place would allow us to build a nice log shell home - and we would end up with the house we wanted.
Hope they go for it. If so, it will become very busy - almost time to plant fall fruit & nut trees, and start shopping for bee-keeping supplies for spring! Many other projects will need immediately attention as well, like having county water run onto the property, building a fence around the fruit trees to deter deer, etc.
Cheers,
Kevin & Evia
We like the remoteness (nice dark skies for Astronomy viewing, and VERY quiet), and not going into debt to buy it. Indeed, we suspect using the financing we had considered for the 80 acre place would allow us to build a nice log shell home - and we would end up with the house we wanted.
Hope they go for it. If so, it will become very busy - almost time to plant fall fruit & nut trees, and start shopping for bee-keeping supplies for spring! Many other projects will need immediately attention as well, like having county water run onto the property, building a fence around the fruit trees to deter deer, etc.
Cheers,
Kevin & Evia
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Andy Hamilton
- Site Admin
- Posts: 6631
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- Location: Bristol
- Contact:
yes, best of luck from me too and a rather belated welcome. 
First we sow the seeds, nature grows the seeds then we eat the seeds. Neil Pye
My best selling Homebrew book Booze for Free
and...... Twitter
The Other Andy Hamilton - Drinks & Foraging
My best selling Homebrew book Booze for Free
and...... Twitter
The Other Andy Hamilton - Drinks & Foraging
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kevinc_63366
- margo - newbie
- Posts: 18
- Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 9:39 pm
Status update
Well.. things are a blur at the moment. We made the $3000/acre "Best and Final" offer, they countered, we rejected.
Happen to be reading the "Missouri Prairie Foundation (MPF)" journal, and caught a side bar article requesting that anyone interesting in buying land contact them. So I did!
By the next day I was chatting the the president of the foundation, and he put me in touch with a local landowner in the "Mystic Conservation Area". This is a small (maybe 25 square mile?) area of North Central Missouri where there are a few remnants of native prairie left, and where there is a restoration project underway for the endangered "Prairie Chicken" (something like 50 males were findable in 1999).
The MPF asked if we would be willing to purchase land in the conservation area, which is about a 3 hour drive for us. We decided we would at least look at it and made plans for last Sunday to drive up and see (we took a side stop and visited a customer's house of Biglogs.com and fell in love with the construction technique - at least we know what type of house we want to build someday). The visit went VERY well, with the local landowner showing us around his 600 acres of restored prairie (he now makes his living selling restoration seeds).
While we were making plans for Sundays visit, I got a call from my Realtor that the owners of the 35 acres wanted to negotiate some more. Told her I'd let her know if we were interested after our visit on Sunday. Sent her a note last night letting her know "No for now - we are going to spend more time in NE Missouri looking". Ok, getting ahead of myself!
One nice thing about the conservation area is that land price is about half of what land near the 35 acres is. The bad thing is that its 3 hours away instead of 1, and will burn a lot more fuel visiting. The good thing is that we can get more land, and help an endangered species. Suppose nothing is every clear and easy!
The MPF has been VERY helpful. Not only are they offering advice and support, they have restoration funds available to assist in restoring whatever property I might buy - so long as I buy within the conservation area. The local contact (Frank Aberle - a fairly well known nature photographer), besides spending several hours of his Sunday with us, put me in contact with a local Realtor, Mark. Mark is literally knocking on doors pulling a list of potential properties together. We in turn have committed to return next weekend, driving up Saturday morning, and looking at property Saturday and Sunday before returning (exhausted I'm sure - the wife and I get to swap carrying our 1 year old!).
Franks tour of his property helped in another critical way: My wife now understands what I've been trying to explain to her was our goal. She got to see it, and is now excited.
Alas, land prices have been jumping up about 20% a year in the area for a variety of reasons: Some Montana cattle ranchers discovered the area has land that cost twice what theirs does, but they can raise at least 4 times the cattle - they are buying up thousands of acres (6000 at last count). Apparently the Amish have also taken up a buying campaign - selling their property in the NE of the USA and moving to the mid-west where they can easily get 2-3 times as much land. Both of these mean that I really need to buy as much as I can possibly afford now - I won't be able to save at a rate that would offset the land inflation. That in turn postpones any building plans.
The other kicker is simply the distance. For the 35 acre plot (or any of the other in that area), we could visit casually - round trip time was about 2 hours. This place has a round trip time of over 6 hours - overnight stays are required if I want to get any serious work done. Not sure how to deal with that.
In any case, I suspect we are now targeting 160-200 acres. I have told the Realtor that if we push past $230K, I'll need something that is solid, warm, dry, and has a bathroom, shower, and a kitchen - someplace we can collapse in safely. Below that, I could (I think) afford to put something cheap on the property - perhaps a used trailer house or small cabin.
Choices are good, but this is getting insane!
Kevin[/b]
Happen to be reading the "Missouri Prairie Foundation (MPF)" journal, and caught a side bar article requesting that anyone interesting in buying land contact them. So I did!
By the next day I was chatting the the president of the foundation, and he put me in touch with a local landowner in the "Mystic Conservation Area". This is a small (maybe 25 square mile?) area of North Central Missouri where there are a few remnants of native prairie left, and where there is a restoration project underway for the endangered "Prairie Chicken" (something like 50 males were findable in 1999).
The MPF asked if we would be willing to purchase land in the conservation area, which is about a 3 hour drive for us. We decided we would at least look at it and made plans for last Sunday to drive up and see (we took a side stop and visited a customer's house of Biglogs.com and fell in love with the construction technique - at least we know what type of house we want to build someday). The visit went VERY well, with the local landowner showing us around his 600 acres of restored prairie (he now makes his living selling restoration seeds).
While we were making plans for Sundays visit, I got a call from my Realtor that the owners of the 35 acres wanted to negotiate some more. Told her I'd let her know if we were interested after our visit on Sunday. Sent her a note last night letting her know "No for now - we are going to spend more time in NE Missouri looking". Ok, getting ahead of myself!
One nice thing about the conservation area is that land price is about half of what land near the 35 acres is. The bad thing is that its 3 hours away instead of 1, and will burn a lot more fuel visiting. The good thing is that we can get more land, and help an endangered species. Suppose nothing is every clear and easy!
The MPF has been VERY helpful. Not only are they offering advice and support, they have restoration funds available to assist in restoring whatever property I might buy - so long as I buy within the conservation area. The local contact (Frank Aberle - a fairly well known nature photographer), besides spending several hours of his Sunday with us, put me in contact with a local Realtor, Mark. Mark is literally knocking on doors pulling a list of potential properties together. We in turn have committed to return next weekend, driving up Saturday morning, and looking at property Saturday and Sunday before returning (exhausted I'm sure - the wife and I get to swap carrying our 1 year old!).
Franks tour of his property helped in another critical way: My wife now understands what I've been trying to explain to her was our goal. She got to see it, and is now excited.
Alas, land prices have been jumping up about 20% a year in the area for a variety of reasons: Some Montana cattle ranchers discovered the area has land that cost twice what theirs does, but they can raise at least 4 times the cattle - they are buying up thousands of acres (6000 at last count). Apparently the Amish have also taken up a buying campaign - selling their property in the NE of the USA and moving to the mid-west where they can easily get 2-3 times as much land. Both of these mean that I really need to buy as much as I can possibly afford now - I won't be able to save at a rate that would offset the land inflation. That in turn postpones any building plans.
The other kicker is simply the distance. For the 35 acre plot (or any of the other in that area), we could visit casually - round trip time was about 2 hours. This place has a round trip time of over 6 hours - overnight stays are required if I want to get any serious work done. Not sure how to deal with that.
In any case, I suspect we are now targeting 160-200 acres. I have told the Realtor that if we push past $230K, I'll need something that is solid, warm, dry, and has a bathroom, shower, and a kitchen - someplace we can collapse in safely. Below that, I could (I think) afford to put something cheap on the property - perhaps a used trailer house or small cabin.
Choices are good, but this is getting insane!
Kevin[/b]
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kevinc_63366
- margo - newbie
- Posts: 18
- Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 9:39 pm
Spent the weekend looking at property in the Mystic Conservation Focus Area. The previous Sunday we looked at a 101 acre parcel and stumbled across a gentlemen associated with an adjoining property. This past weekend we walked their 136 acres, several times.
Frank Oberle (sorry, spelled it wrong in an earlier post) went out with a teraforming friend and gave it "Two Thumbs Up!". We made a bid last night! The land is hilly and used for grazing, although a few neighbors row crop. The teraforming guy found several places we could put nice 5-7 acre lakes in. There is about 300 acres of watershed that drains into the property, so filling the lake wouldn't be a problem (dealing with the overflow might though!).
It does have a single-wide trailer on it, so basic shelter is covered. Public water is also available.
Now we wait to hear back...
Kevin
Frank Oberle (sorry, spelled it wrong in an earlier post) went out with a teraforming friend and gave it "Two Thumbs Up!". We made a bid last night! The land is hilly and used for grazing, although a few neighbors row crop. The teraforming guy found several places we could put nice 5-7 acre lakes in. There is about 300 acres of watershed that drains into the property, so filling the lake wouldn't be a problem (dealing with the overflow might though!).
It does have a single-wide trailer on it, so basic shelter is covered. Public water is also available.
Now we wait to hear back...
Kevin
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kevinc_63366
- margo - newbie
- Posts: 18
- Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 9:39 pm
Status update
Thought I'd post a status update:
We are now focusing our attention in the Mystic area. That said, about a month ago I got a call from my agent regarding the 34.76 acre parcel. The owners wanted to know if I would split the difference with then. We declined. Last Friday they called again - they would accept our last offer if we would extend it again. We have until Monday to let them know, but I don't think we will. Had they accepted when we offered, we would have been planting fruit trees this weekend. Oh well.
The Mystic area is proving interesting. The first 101 acre parcel we looked at was trashed - grazed to the ground, trash in the gullies, gullies!, but fixable given lots of dozer time and a few years. While walking it we met the neighbors - and they indicated they might be willing to sell...
Their 136 acres is now in a "pending" state. They decided they didn't want to list with any agent, but if they can find a place to move too, they will sell to me after January. It is a pretty place - with a large enough dam we could have a nice 7 acre lake without problems (there is about 300 acres of watershed that drains through this property into a nearby creek).
While we are waiting to see about the 136, we have looked at several others. Next weekend we are going up to see a 350 acre tract that is in two parcels - a 229 part and a 121 part. The 229 is adjoining a Missouri Heritage Land nominee - one of the few remaining tracks of native prairie in the state and has a population of endangered Prairie Chickens on it. The Missouri Prairie Foundation is very keen on my buying some of this property, although the 136 would be fine too.
I have played with Google Earth aerials and believe we could carve a 208 acre parcel out of the 229, be flat broke, but have the largest parcel we could possibly afford. Our agent is uncharacteristically upbeat about our chances. We shall see.
Cheers,
Kevin
We are now focusing our attention in the Mystic area. That said, about a month ago I got a call from my agent regarding the 34.76 acre parcel. The owners wanted to know if I would split the difference with then. We declined. Last Friday they called again - they would accept our last offer if we would extend it again. We have until Monday to let them know, but I don't think we will. Had they accepted when we offered, we would have been planting fruit trees this weekend. Oh well.
The Mystic area is proving interesting. The first 101 acre parcel we looked at was trashed - grazed to the ground, trash in the gullies, gullies!, but fixable given lots of dozer time and a few years. While walking it we met the neighbors - and they indicated they might be willing to sell...
Their 136 acres is now in a "pending" state. They decided they didn't want to list with any agent, but if they can find a place to move too, they will sell to me after January. It is a pretty place - with a large enough dam we could have a nice 7 acre lake without problems (there is about 300 acres of watershed that drains through this property into a nearby creek).
While we are waiting to see about the 136, we have looked at several others. Next weekend we are going up to see a 350 acre tract that is in two parcels - a 229 part and a 121 part. The 229 is adjoining a Missouri Heritage Land nominee - one of the few remaining tracks of native prairie in the state and has a population of endangered Prairie Chickens on it. The Missouri Prairie Foundation is very keen on my buying some of this property, although the 136 would be fine too.
I have played with Google Earth aerials and believe we could carve a 208 acre parcel out of the 229, be flat broke, but have the largest parcel we could possibly afford. Our agent is uncharacteristically upbeat about our chances. We shall see.
Cheers,
Kevin
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yugogypsy
Kevin Carpenter Introduction
Hello and Welcome
I'm on one acre with a 660 square foot house in Canada, definitely on the small size, even with just my partner Rick and I living here.
I was lucky, I inherited this property from my parents and so far we have a 3000 sq ft garden in 4 patches, chickens, 2 cats a donkey and a small horse.
We have a tenant in a travel trailer to help off-set costs, something you may want to consider, a friend of mine in Arkansas has a tenant in a double wide trailer.
OR get yourself a trailer to live in while your house is being built and rent it after if its legal with your land zoning to do that.
Upcoming plans here are a new structure on an old travel trailer frame, converting a Mercedes cargo van into a potting shed and re-finishing the greenhouse.
We had the house painted this summer, Rick re-built the barn and hayshed and built the chicken coop, after demolishing two campers and a crazy shed that one of my ex's had built.
We've been at this 5 years, so don't try to do everything at once-start with a basic food garden and work up, thats what we did and we're almost at the point now where I can sell a few veg and eggs to supplement our disability income.
Take Care and Best of Luck
Lois
I'm on one acre with a 660 square foot house in Canada, definitely on the small size, even with just my partner Rick and I living here.
I was lucky, I inherited this property from my parents and so far we have a 3000 sq ft garden in 4 patches, chickens, 2 cats a donkey and a small horse.
We have a tenant in a travel trailer to help off-set costs, something you may want to consider, a friend of mine in Arkansas has a tenant in a double wide trailer.
OR get yourself a trailer to live in while your house is being built and rent it after if its legal with your land zoning to do that.
Upcoming plans here are a new structure on an old travel trailer frame, converting a Mercedes cargo van into a potting shed and re-finishing the greenhouse.
We had the house painted this summer, Rick re-built the barn and hayshed and built the chicken coop, after demolishing two campers and a crazy shed that one of my ex's had built.
We've been at this 5 years, so don't try to do everything at once-start with a basic food garden and work up, thats what we did and we're almost at the point now where I can sell a few veg and eggs to supplement our disability income.
Take Care and Best of Luck
Lois
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kevinc_63366
- margo - newbie
- Posts: 18
- Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 9:39 pm
Success!
We close on Saturday on 121 acres! Its a long drive, but we got it at $1400/acre.
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Smallholder1
- Jerry - Bit higher than newbie
- Posts: 39
- Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2006 2:28 pm
- Location: Widnes, Cheshire
- Contact:
Been following your progress in this thread.............congratulations! 
Joseph Kennedy's most excellent band!
http://www.myspace.com/captivestatemusic
"Activism is the rent I pay for living on this planet" - Alice Walker
http://www.myspace.com/captivestatemusic
"Activism is the rent I pay for living on this planet" - Alice Walker
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yugogypsy
Kevin Carpenter Introduction
Congratulations Kevin!
Thats great news, just remember, don't try to do everything at once.
Lois
Thats great news, just remember, don't try to do everything at once.
Lois