£1,500 wind turbine that barely powers a hairdryer.
From the Daily Mail today. The above headline. (p33)
Load of hot air? Thousands are buying household turbines, It say's.
Lots of stuff here to deter the would be buyer of self sufficient goodies.
Pay back time of 15 years quoted. Sounds like many other products.
The point here is lots of money for little return. I think a small wind turbine that produces 12v, charging 12v batteries, powering 12v items, is a good way to go, what do you think? 12v lighting is very good, lots of other 12v items about including hairdryers. You will likely produce adequate power if you don't try to power up 240v hairdryers, washing machines and the like. An idea that may not have been looked at here? is making a small cheap turbine from a cycle hub dynamo, if it only costs £30 (unless you have an old bike with one) it could be useful and fun to play with. Won't take 15 years to get you money back either.
Best way to spend your money loads of insulation, Is it an old wives tale about Scandinavian homes being so well insulated that they barely need heating? Triple glazing and all that.
John
£1500 wind turbine that barely powers a hairdryer
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Stonehead
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The telling quote is:
Now watch out as the micro wind generation PR men pop out of the woodwork with their pre-prepared rep-lies...
Oh, and the Trade and Industry Secretary Alistair Darling recently said there was an urgent need to switch people's massive use of energy to more green-friendly, renewable sources and this could mean requiring people to have a wind turbine or PV system - at their expense of course.
Let me guess which lobbyists are behind that one...
It's not about saving the planet, it's about making a quick profit from gullible people with guilty consciences and deep pockets.Although there are currently just 650 home wind turbines installed that number is set to grow massively as the makers of the most popular wind turbine, Windsave, have had orders of more than 15,000 ahead of Christmas for their WS1000 unit which sells for just under £1,500 at B&Q.
Now watch out as the micro wind generation PR men pop out of the woodwork with their pre-prepared rep-lies...
Oh, and the Trade and Industry Secretary Alistair Darling recently said there was an urgent need to switch people's massive use of energy to more green-friendly, renewable sources and this could mean requiring people to have a wind turbine or PV system - at their expense of course.
Let me guess which lobbyists are behind that one...
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Martin
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http://solarwind.org.uk - a small company in Sussex sourcing, supplying, and fitting alternative energy products.
Amateurs encouraged - very keen prices and friendly helpful service!
Amateurs encouraged - very keen prices and friendly helpful service!
Do Windsave really expect us to believe they have orders for more than 15000 turbines? I have just read an article I found on the web from the BBC, dated Nov. 2004. In it Brian Wilson (ex labour energy minister and now frontmant fo Windsave) states that Windsave would be selling 500 turbines a week in 2005.
Well i wont be paying money to anyone for a wind turbine.
When i move house and get settled in i will be making my own windturbine
To charge a bank of 12 volt lesiure batterys which then in turn would run 12 volt appliances in my shed and if needed 240 volt appliances via an inverter.
It will start out as an experimental project and my designs,ideas and results will be shared with everyone on the web for free.
I am going to use as many reclaimed and recycled parts as possible.
I will be using the savonius design of rotor that has a high torque and will work quite adequately in the tubulant wind found in built up areas.
The major problem to over come is the generator.
I need to find a permenant magnet dc motor/generator that at low rpm will produce voltage in the range of 13 volts-18 volts dc.
I have collected many 12 volts motors from auto applications and other sources and after using a variable speed electric drill to drive them whilst checking the output voltage on a volt meter i havent found one that will produce enough voltage to be of any use.
I could step up a lower voltage but it would incurr loses and decrease the charging current.
A car alternator seems an obvious choice as it charges car batterys all day long.
But on further inspection a car alternator is not suitable because it need to be ran at very high rpm and it uses part of its generated charge to make the magnetic field so is not very efficiant.
I think my next step will be to wind my own generator and use permenant field magnets.
Unless anyopne knows a piece of equipment thats readily available that would have a suitable dc permenant magnet motor/generator i could salvage to provide the charge?
When i move house and get settled in i will be making my own windturbine
To charge a bank of 12 volt lesiure batterys which then in turn would run 12 volt appliances in my shed and if needed 240 volt appliances via an inverter.
It will start out as an experimental project and my designs,ideas and results will be shared with everyone on the web for free.
I am going to use as many reclaimed and recycled parts as possible.
I will be using the savonius design of rotor that has a high torque and will work quite adequately in the tubulant wind found in built up areas.
The major problem to over come is the generator.
I need to find a permenant magnet dc motor/generator that at low rpm will produce voltage in the range of 13 volts-18 volts dc.
I have collected many 12 volts motors from auto applications and other sources and after using a variable speed electric drill to drive them whilst checking the output voltage on a volt meter i havent found one that will produce enough voltage to be of any use.
I could step up a lower voltage but it would incurr loses and decrease the charging current.
A car alternator seems an obvious choice as it charges car batterys all day long.
But on further inspection a car alternator is not suitable because it need to be ran at very high rpm and it uses part of its generated charge to make the magnetic field so is not very efficiant.
I think my next step will be to wind my own generator and use permenant field magnets.
Unless anyopne knows a piece of equipment thats readily available that would have a suitable dc permenant magnet motor/generator i could salvage to provide the charge?
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Stonehead
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You can rewind a car (or truck) alternator by replacing the stator windings with more turns of smaller gauge wire. However, you'd have to get the maths right to get the wire gauge and number of windings right.
I've been looking at rewinding a Lister alternator for a separate job (veg oil power), but it's quite a skilled job to get it right.
From what I've read, the best bet if you're going the homebrew wind turbine route is a permanent magnet alternator as pioneered by Hugh Piggott using Volvo disc brake assemblies.
However, another choice might be an induction motor conversion. You cut a groove in the centre core, stick permanent magnets in the groove and way you go. Downsides are that you need to be able to do the machining, internal resistance limits power output and the faster the speed of the turbine, the less efficient an induction motor alternator is.
I've also seen a small turbine that used the 12V DC motor from an computer WORM drive. The blades were only a few feet across, but it generated just enough power to run a couple of 12v lights in a shed.
The main thing is not to re-invent the wheel! Plenty of people have tried different alternators (and generators) with wind turbines, discovered the flaws in the different designs and conversion, and then published the details.
Good luck.
I've been looking at rewinding a Lister alternator for a separate job (veg oil power), but it's quite a skilled job to get it right.
From what I've read, the best bet if you're going the homebrew wind turbine route is a permanent magnet alternator as pioneered by Hugh Piggott using Volvo disc brake assemblies.
However, another choice might be an induction motor conversion. You cut a groove in the centre core, stick permanent magnets in the groove and way you go. Downsides are that you need to be able to do the machining, internal resistance limits power output and the faster the speed of the turbine, the less efficient an induction motor alternator is.
I've also seen a small turbine that used the 12V DC motor from an computer WORM drive. The blades were only a few feet across, but it generated just enough power to run a couple of 12v lights in a shed.
The main thing is not to re-invent the wheel! Plenty of people have tried different alternators (and generators) with wind turbines, discovered the flaws in the different designs and conversion, and then published the details.
Good luck.
Last edited by Stonehead on Tue Nov 14, 2006 1:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Wow, Paradox, a like mind. Lots of stuff available on ebay. Small turbines to play with that give a little power, and more serious ones that are possibly a better way to go for not too much money. It may be possible to use a vehicle cooling fan attached to a small cycle hub motor. I have got interested in playing with some experiments, free energy from a lemon? or vinegar battery, to weird, but you can measure and use the tiny amount of power and 100% free. Gets you thinking outside of the box perhaps. I noticed a wind generator, ebay, that lights up an led to fix onto a bike or car, a bit of nonsense, again, but its instructive at about a pound or two.
John
John
Driving auto alternaters with a drill brought home to me the huge resistance of these things. I think for real results buy a manufactured turbine new, (good to play around with stuff first though) lots of competition now with those American ones on ebay, for example. even a secondhand one. Look out for the quoted windspeed needed to produce power. Scam on ebay, one warning posted up there now, you would be a bit dotty to go for that.
Planning permission may be needed I read, but with a small one you should not any complaints.
John
Planning permission may be needed I read, but with a small one you should not any complaints.
John
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Stonehead
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Mount it on a trailer so it's a temporary structure. I found a Lister-powered 12m-high lighting tower that would have done the job (a snip at £400), but the OH said we really needed to get the car repaired first, buy a boar and a few other sensible things.jondy wrote:Planning permission may be needed I read, but with a small one you should not any complaints.
John
Anyway, you could take the lights off the hydraulic pole, stick a wind turbine on top, and then use the Lister diesel (on veg oil) to hoist it up and down.
My idea of fun!
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Martin
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good site for small homebuilds - http://www.gotwind.org/
the excellent Hugh Piggott site - http://scoraigwind.com/
and if you want a really good resource all about wind, this is a Danish site that's got the lot! - http://www.windpower.org/en/tour.htm
the excellent Hugh Piggott site - http://scoraigwind.com/
and if you want a really good resource all about wind, this is a Danish site that's got the lot! - http://www.windpower.org/en/tour.htm
http://solarwind.org.uk - a small company in Sussex sourcing, supplying, and fitting alternative energy products.
Amateurs encouraged - very keen prices and friendly helpful service!
Amateurs encouraged - very keen prices and friendly helpful service!
-
Martin
- A selfsufficientish Regular
- Posts: 2029
- Joined: Sat May 06, 2006 8:50 am
- Location: Nr Heathfield, East Sussex
- Contact:
http://solarwind.org.uk - a small company in Sussex sourcing, supplying, and fitting alternative energy products.
Amateurs encouraged - very keen prices and friendly helpful service!
Amateurs encouraged - very keen prices and friendly helpful service!
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Martin
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it certainly looked like it! It was actually revolving at a reasonable rate when I saw it - I think they use the power to illuminate some small leds on the "blades" 
The second one had what looked suspiciously like an off the shelf pmg (as can be bought for about 150 quid - and was whacking round at a fair rate!
The second one had what looked suspiciously like an off the shelf pmg (as can be bought for about 150 quid - and was whacking round at a fair rate!
http://solarwind.org.uk - a small company in Sussex sourcing, supplying, and fitting alternative energy products.
Amateurs encouraged - very keen prices and friendly helpful service!
Amateurs encouraged - very keen prices and friendly helpful service!