dust to dust.........

[Martin]

yet another misconception debunked! - if anyone saw Newsnight last night, they debunked the myth about "eco cars" - in simple terms, a big yankee gas guzzler like a Jeep Cherokee uses less energy over it's entire lifetime than something like a Prius........all down to the intricacy and enormous energy cost of building the things - the relatively simple machine, although using more fuel, overall is less cost to the planet!

[Stonehead]

yet another misconception debunked! - if anyone saw Newsnight last night, they debunked the myth about "eco cars" - in simple terms, a big yankee gas guzzler like a Jeep Cherokee uses less energy over it's entire lifetime than something like a Prius........all down to the intricacy and enormous energy cost of building the things - the relatively simple machine, although using more fuel, overall is less cost to the planet!

It's something I've been arguing for yonks. It's why encouraging people to buy new, eco-friendly cars is often not a good idea. People should be encouraged to drive less and if they do buy an eco-friendly car, it should be for the long term.

What I'd like to see governments do is encourage or force the car manufacturers to develop engine and ancillary packages that could be dropped into older cars to make them more economical, less polluting and even powered by renewables.

There could also be subsidies for the less affluent to help them do this.

You'd take your old car in at, say, eight years get a hybrid engine or a cleaner engine fitted and have the safety aspects overhauled.

Combine this with measures to make manufacturers build cars that last longer, measures to get people to cut back to a single car used less often, encourage more use of public transport powered by renewables, subsidise cycles, encourage walking and encourage local work patterns, goods distribution, schooling and shopping, and make better use of canals with renewables powered narrow boats for cargo transport. That would start making a difference.

Oh, and for the doubters - the aircraft industry has been doing this for years. They keep the old airframes, whip out the engines and avionics, replace them with newer, more efficient ones, and away they go again.

[pskipper]

What I'd like to see governments do is encourage or force the car manufacturers to develop engine and ancillary packages that could be dropped into older cars to make them more economical, less polluting

That's why when I've finished restoring her I'm going to be driving a Morris Minor. Environmental impact of production is massively reduced as it's spread out over 35 years (and still going) and doesn't include all the plastics and fancy electronic mcgubins found in cars these days. Repairing the car costs less than a modern car. The technology is equivalent to a modern car (monocoque shell etc, although I will be improving the brakes and suspension) and she'll do between 40-45mpg with emissions which would pass the pre-catalyst tests! (Admittedly she won't need that as the MOT emissions test for a Morris Minor envolves reving the engine, if you get a big cloud of smoke it fails :) ). One of the main restoration companies recently won an environmental award for the sustainable car concept.

As for renewable power, good idea! If they started selling ethanol at the pumps I'd be more than happy to convert (again with the MM it would take less than a day to convert her to run on Ethanol).

Combine this with measures to make manufacturers build cars that last longer, measures to get people to cut back to a single car used less often, encourage more use of public transport powered by renewables, subsidise cycles, encourage walking and encourage local work patterns, goods distribution, schooling and shopping, and make better use of canals with renewables powered narrow boats for cargo transport. That would start making a difference.

I agree, sadly I work in a profession where local work patterns don't exist anymore.

Anyway, I'd better get back to the exciting 40 page good practice and ethics guidance I'm supposed to be reading
Philip.

[Martin]

a moggie!
That distinctive exhaust note! - superb vehicles!
About twenty years ago, I used a Moggie van, followed by a "Traveller" - loved them to bits!
Now that's being really green, and in great style!

[Stonehead]

a moggie!
That distinctive exhaust note! - superb vehicles!
About twenty years ago, I used a Moggie van, followed by a "Traveller" - loved them to bits!
Now that's being really green, and in great style!

With a couple of friends, I built a really mad Moggie up some years back. It had a supercharged, bored out, 1.3-litre engine (from a crashed Cooper S), close ratio, straight cut gearbox, disc brake front end, revamped suspension, etc. We hand painted it grey with a door in red primer so that it looked like an old wreck.

That was one crazy car - went like s*** off a shovel, stopped well and cornered brilliantly. I wonder where it is now...

[pskipper]

There's a bloke near Dundee has a V8 one, not so environmantally friendly but I wouldn't mind a go!