keeping pigs and Gordon Ramsey

[Stonehead]

Oh, it's much, much worse than that...

Take our potato haulms, to prevent blight outbreaks you should either burn or hot compost the haulms.

But, if you have pigs, you can't compost.

But, under the new Waste Regulations you can't burn them either unless you have a paragraph 30 exemption from the Environment Agency or SEPA.

But, if you do get the exemption, you can't start your fire with paper or cardboard (and definitely not paraffin, lighter fuel, VVQ fuel) as it's illegal to burn these.

Okay, you've got through all that and want to use your old waste engine oil to heat your outbuildings For that, you now need a licence exemption from the relevant authority, which may be the local authority or the Environment Agency depending on the specific circumstances.

While waiting for your waste oil heating licence to come through, one of your chickens dies from cold. Can you bury it? No, it is illegal for fallen stock to be buried or burnt in the open because of the risk of disease spread through groundwater or air pollution.

Can you burn the chicken? Not unless you have an approved on-farm incinerator.

So, you're paying £50 to the National Fallen Stock Company, can they handle it? No, the poultry industry has its own specifc exemption and disposal arrangements - which are only applicable to the big, specialist poultry producers.

Can you put it in the bin? No. That's illegal disposal of on-farm waste.

Can you eat it? (Not that I'd want to!) No, it's not fit for human consumption.

And so it goes on and on. For myself, I'm trying to find a bokor to revive my dead chooks as zombie hens...

[bwaymark]

When we lived in France I noticed that everything seemed to be absolutely regulated to death. Indeed, it was so bad that you barely stay alive and solvent if you followed all the regulations. Indeed, I often wondered how how any in France did anything until one day I went to the local town office and asked about having a campfire for my step-sons birthday ... (and apologies to everyone whose heard this story before) ... the chap their, in an animated fashion that no-Anglo Saxon could ever copy said, very loudly (but in French):

"No, no, absolutely not. It is strictly forbidden to have fires in the town of Labastide. It is strictly forbidden to have any fires, especially this time of year, because its dry and two years ago there were big forest fires all over this area. You are absolutely not allowed to have a campfire." and he continued on this vein for about five minutes then concluded: "So if you are going to have a camp fire make sure its small."

It was long after that I also discovered that France has the highest taxation rate in the Western Europe and also the lowest tax collection rate in Western Europe.

It would seem that sometimes the best way to have no regulation is to have too many regulations. And we ain't far off from that in this country!

[Shirley]

It's enough to put people off keeping animals... !!

So... is there a way around it. I'm thinking that we could separate our land into two... a fence right the way down with no access... we've already got road access at the other end... if we use that area for animals and keep the garden bit for growing veggies etc, then would we be able to compost on the garden bit??

So.. what can we do with dead chooks then?? It's all completely bonkers!!!

[red]

Contaminated catering waste is thought to have been the cause [..] of the foot-and-mouth disease outbreak in 2001

Really? How did it get in the catering waste, then?

I though it was down to some twerp bringing livestock into the country 'unofficially'.

no its some twerp bring in 'unofficial' meat - such as cured sausage, with swine fever/ f&m etc containted within, then chucking the scraps to the pigs

the reality of the pig in the back yard is in war times and it was encouraged cos frankly there was not enough food, now its different.

Also - It was int eh local paper a while back, someone who got waste food from the dairy factory nearby - milk products, for his pigs but some disinfectant got put in the bins in error. his pigs got ill, and he sued the factory. then they stopped letting people have the waste. who would have thought it...

it is a shame tho and not helpful that books such as John Seymours SF book details giving kitchen waste to their pigs..

[Stonehead]

The 2000 Classical Swine Fever outbreak was almost certainly caused by a hiker throwing infected meat to pigs (a lot of footpaths pass through the pig farm where the first outbreak occurred).

The 1986 CSF outbreak was the one caused by household scraps being fed to pigs - in three different places around the country. The contamination was traced back to the same importer in each case.

The index case in the 2001 FMD Outbreak was on a farm licenced to feed waste food under the Animal By Products Order 1991. While it's implied that the waste food was the cause, it you read the State Veterinary Journal and other papers carefully you'll see that people like the Chief Veterinary Officer do not actually say it was the cause.

This is in marked contrast to other disease outbreaks where they identifiy an epidemiological cause (as with the CSF outbreaks above).

One of the biggest factors in the spread of FMD in 2001 was the delay between the introduction of the infection and the reporting of the disease to the authorities. This was then exacerbated by the way in which livestock is now transported around the UK (50 premises were infected by the time FMD was diagnosed).

And yes, I do read a lot of this stuff.

[ina]

Pssst, don't tell anybody:

My compost heap is at the back of my garden - it was there when I moved in, and I saw no reason to move it away. The cows and sheep in the field next to the garden regularly rootle through my compost and pick out the nice bits... Is that my fault now, or the fault of the owner of the livestock? Anyway, those blimming cows also leant over the fence and pulled out my nicest tatties when the grass was getting a bit short for them. And they eat holes in my beech hedge.

[Shirley]

I eventually got a reply from Defra

Dear Shirley
ANIMAL BY-PRODUCTS REGULATIONS
Thank you for your email of 21 September about catering waste and the animal by-products (ABP) regulations. I have been asked to reply.
The Animal By-Products Regulation (EC) no. 1774/2002 introduced an EU wide ban on the feeding of catering waste (or Swill) to animals, whether processed or not. The UK had banned swill feeding in 2001 during Foot and Mouth Disease. Under the ABP Regulation, catering waste includes domestic kitchen waste and there is no distinction between commercial animals or private pets.
To your point regarding composting, the Government is keen to promote the use of household composting as part of its waste minimisation strategy. In your particular case however, you should ensure that the animals cannot access the compost.
The Defra website has more information non the ABP regulations and can be viewed onlie at:
www.defra.gov.uk/animalh/by-prods/default.htm
I hope that this answers your questions.
Yours sincerely


Andrew Morrissy
Customer Contact Unit

[maggie144]

I have read all things written on this subject and i have tonight e mailed defra asking them to explain whats going to happen when the council start charging us for overweight or bins that are nor being recycled properly , whos going to pay the fine.

i have informed them that i will send the bill to their head office, after all i am doing everything i can to save our planet, by recyling everything i can the food waste that i recycle is organic from my property or from my butcher who also deals with organic meats. so it is not contaminated. so i don't see why i should stop feeding scraps to my chooks/goats they are really healthly and they enjoy it

maggie

[bazil]

buried chicken covered in lime officer?.....ummm....yes....we have a very tidy little fox who runs around with a bag of lime

[Rohen]

http://www.pig-arcs.co.uk/pig-starter-kit.html


Is how he kept his pigs

[Shirley]

I have read all things written on this subject and i have tonight e mailed defra asking them to explain whats going to happen when the council start charging us for overweight or bins that are nor being recycled properly , whos going to pay the fine.

i have informed them that i will send the bill to their head office, after all i am doing everything i can to save our planet, by recyling everything i can the food waste that i recycle is organic from my property or from my butcher who also deals with organic meats. so it is not contaminated. so i don't see why i should stop feeding scraps to my chooks/goats they are really healthly and they enjoy it

maggie

Did you ever get a reply back Maggie??

[secrets]

it makes me fume that regulations are taking over our lives.
i,m sure life was much simpler and enjoyable before the EU began telling us what to do.?
but then who would have thought that Britain would become a police state. ?

[Jack]

Gidday

From what I have seen and heard, the biggest trouble with keeping pigs and Gordon Ramsey, would be when you went to slaughter you would have to be bloody careful to let the right one out.

[Millymollymandy]

Good one Jack!