If I ruled the world

[Stonehead]

Although you are right that most people cannot be arsed to get off their bums I think it is not as straight forward as that.

If there was a local group or indeed a load of local groups around the country then I would join and help out. I am sure many would. I think it is more down to not knowing what is out there. I mean how do you get together and get a turbine for your street/estate/block of flats? How do you start a co-op? How do you set up community gardens.

I've been trying to do/start/initiate/join this sort of thing for years. Many people just can't see beyond the day to day consumerist society (get up, go to work, come home, go shopping, sleep, repeat). Others are just too cynical. Some are downright antipathic and a few want to stop you in your tracks.

That's why I love the internet and forums like this. It makes it so much easier to meet like-minded people from all over the world as well as from your own area.

My current position is a good example of this - there are a few good people in the village, but none are really in tune with what we're trying to do. However, via this forum, freecycle, my blog, other people's blogs and other forums I've met almost a dozen individuals/couples/families with broadly similar philosophies.

None are right on my doorstep, but we're close enough to each other than we can meet fairly easily and help each other out. At the same time, we have the wider support and advice of the larger, global group.

So, vive la internet!

Stonehead

[Martin]

I think the internet is a wonderful medium - but do take heart - uptake is still dreadfully slow, I recently built a village website (a village of some 300 souls)
- out of that lot, we had 3 with the competence to post articles who actually joined in - about 7 others who "popped in to view" from time to time, and clutter all else!
SO hopefully there are probably people within spitting distance of you who do hold similar views......
If all else fails, BBC local radio is excellent for "fringe" pursuits - they're forever looking for something "newsworthy" - if you 'phone the station, ask for a programme researcher, tell them you want to start a local "build your own turbine" group - "is there anybody out there in radioland who'd be interested" sort of thing - you'll probably find yourself on air on a 'phone-in local affairs programme - same thing goes for an allotment buying co-op - just DO IT!
Have a look at Hugh's site - http://www.scoraigwind.com/ - lovely bloke - he's usually off in some third-world country showing people how to build their own turbines, largely from scrap - you'd do far worse than going his route! 8)
Again - JUST DO IT!

[Martin]

how to do it yourself- in pictures! http://www.blueenergy.org/MultiMedia/Pi ... uring1.htm

[Stonehead]

If all else fails, BBC local radio is excellent for "fringe" pursuits - they're forever looking for something "newsworthy" - if you 'phone the station, ask for a programme researcher, tell them you want to start a local "build your own turbine" group - "is there anybody out there in radioland who'd be interested" sort of thing - you'll probably find yourself on air on a 'phone-in local affairs programme - same thing goes for an allotment buying co-op - just DO IT!

Yes, I know all about the newsworthy game. Been there, done that, got the medals! Prefer to avoid it these days, but useful when fighting the water battle.

Again - JUST DO IT!

So many things things to do, though. I'm currently (hah, in between everything else more like) rebuilding a Lister Start-O-Matic to run on vegetable oil and am working out a pre-heating system. Then there's the vegetable oil fueled water pumping system, the compost heap water heating system, the grey water recycling system, and....

No, one thing at a time and the first one is - get some kip!

Goodnight.

Stonehead

[Martin]

- you missed out the poo-power plant!
- I was thinking more of Andy than you about the radio and self-help groups - you're probably doing more than most people ever will!

[Wombat]

G'Day All,

I have found this to be a very interesting thread.

I don't know how I would go on a clipper ship - sea sickness and all - but the idea is a good one. I saw a prototype for aship years ago that had savonius rotors instead of sails. Are you faialar with that one Martin or Muddy?

I dont see that the to approaches are mutually exclsive - top down or bottom up. Let's install Andy as the benevolent eco-dictator and then start the grass roots revolution ourselves. Bruvvers! (and sisters)

Nev

[Martin]

it all just seems so barmy - in the western world many people have genuinely disposable income (they buy NEW cars for instance) - all we need is a change of attitude/fashion - instead of heaping our money into a depreciating asset (the car), run a bit of a banger, and invest in something that will generate power instead... we need to give it a "cool" edge! How do we make wind turbines and solar panels sexy?
I'm not fussy, I could put up with people with more money than sense investing in "lifestyle statement turbines" - I can see them now, proudly posing at the base of their titanium wind turbine mast (designed by Philip Starck) - with their "porsche designed" windmill atop it -all boring grey, and ruthless teutonic efficiency - if you look closely, he's got the matching shades.........(only £600 a pair)..........

[Stonehead]

I could put up with people with more money than sense investing in "lifestyle statement turbines" - I can see them now, proudly posing at the base of their titanium wind turbine mast (designed by Philip Starck) - with their "porsche designed" windmill atop it -all boring grey, and ruthless teutonic efficiency - if you look closely, he's got the matching shades.........(only £600 a pair)..........

You've hit the nail on the head. Outside we fringers, most of the people seen in the media with wind turbines, PV etc are politicians seeking to make a political statement. Who wants to emulate them and their borking houses?

As you say, alternative energy needs to be seen as a cool and a lifestyle statement to get all the consumers on board.

So, what sort of wind turbine and PV set up would you sell to a chav? Masts with Burberry plaid? Or how about a blinged-up manure digester...

Stonehead

[Andy Hamilton]

I take what you mean about uptake. This site started in April 2004, I am very happy with where it is at now though.

I think turbines are slowly becoming more and more en vouge. Think back to about 5-10 years ago no one had really heard of them. They don't need to look good, we just need celebrity endorsement. Burbery was such a ig hit last year (or was it the year before) because of a certain footballer dubed the King of Chav's.

Perhaps there could be a 'pimp my turbine' program on chanel 5 to acompany the turbines new found fame. If your not sure what I mean....

On a whim I have just bought mylocalturbine.com ..... I had some free credits with the new server. I shall set up a forum on it where people can try and get a group together to get a turbine for their street/village or whatever. Will see if does anything but it is a start.

I am thinking that next could be a leaflet campagin in my street. There are about 100 houses here, what size turbine would that need? Also where could it go. The gardens/yards are not that big around here, about 20ft square.

[Stonehead]

We'd better get moving, I think more fuel price rises are on the cards...

Tehran warns of fuel disruptions

Stonehead

[Tigerhair]

What really annoys me is business flights when we now have 3g and video confrencing. Is it necessary???

Where I used to work they were a technology company and had all the up to date whizz bang stuff, I used to push for telephone conferences and was really keen on getting them to install video conferencing, but it was a case of "yeah, but it's different if you're in the room" from the sales people.... so frustrating as they had never actually tried the alternative!

[Stonehead]

The best thing about teleconferencing is... no over-perfumed women, no one with mint on their breath to mask their drinking problem and no BO!

Stonehead

[ina]

I personally hate video conferencing - hate to have the camera pointed at me (or rather following my every movement automatically), it totally puts me off thinking straight. We had one of our lectures at college via a video link with another college, and I stopped going because I simply couldn't take anything in.

And phone conferencing - not so bad, but... We once arranged for one at the Institute, with folks in three different countries - and just as we were about to start, we had a fire alarm exercise.... So it all had to be set up again.

[Andy Hamilton]

I personally hate video conferencing - hate to have the camera pointed at me (or rather following my every movement automatically), it totally puts me off thinking straight. We had one of our lectures at college via a video link with another college, and I stopped going because I simply couldn't take anything in.
.

I supose it is not for everyone then but even if each company tried to have just the big meetings via telephone or video conferancing think of all the air miles saved.

[ina]

I quite agree, Andy - but then, I think a lot of these international meetings are mainly to give folks the chance to travel on the expense account... Most stuff could be done by e-mail; or not in co-operation with other countries - oh yes, I'm all for working together, but quite often the result of a project would be quicker, cheaper, greener if local people worked together...

Just had that discussion today with a colleague: Why does management think we should do more research in Africa and other tropical countries? There's plenty of local people there who could do their own research, proably with much better understanding of the problems! But that wouldn't get THEIR names known all over the world, and they wouldn't get to visit those countries...