Help please.Thoughts on "ethical diet"would be appreciated!

[thomasgreen]

Hello everybody...

I have got my brain into a little bit of a pickle. I became a vegetarian around 4 years ago for several reasons;

-i do not believe in the big "agri-businesses" which seem to be so dominant in the meat market in this country
-the research that I did seemed to point towards livestock farming being a major source of pollution, especially compared to arable farming
-i wanted to live in the most "harm free" way possible. Eating animals is rather harmful top their health...

The problem that I have come across is that beans/nuts/seeds are not produced locally let alone anywhere near the UK?!

So I started chomping on a little fish. But due to there being too many people on the plant/we are greedy the numbers of wild fish are declining/many species are becoming endangered. Are fish farms a good solution to this?

My wife and I would absolutely love to raise our own livestock but we do not have the space/can't afford any more space/I really do not have the time as I work full time as a community psychiatric nurse.

So... I have got myself in a right royal tizz and the more I read/research the more I get confused. I would really appreciate other peoples thoughts/feelings/findings on the topic of "the most ethical diet" or "the diet of least impact".

Thanks very much. I am looking forward to some ideas/discussion etc.

[frozenthunderbolt]

Try reading 'diet for a small planet'

[KathyLauren]

I second the recommendation for "Diet for a Small Planet". Just be sure to get a modern edition, as the original edition contained some major nutritional errors that the author corrected in recent editions.

One of the errors in the first edition of DFASP was the whole incomplete protein thing. On a plant-based diet, you do need to ensure that you eat legumes, along with grains fruits and vegetables. They don't need to be combined in any specific way as long as you eat from each group regularly. Peas and beans will grow in the U.K. If you are lacto-ovo vegetarian, protein is not an issue at all, and most people don't need as much as they think they do anyway.

Fish farms could in theory be a good thing (if you are not a fish!), if they were self-contained. But most fish farms are based in the open ocean, which causes serious pollution and is endangering wild fish stocks, particularly of related species. Open-ocean fish farms are a very bad thing.

[frozenthunderbolt]

Fish farms could in theory be a good thing (if you are not a fish!), if they were self-contained. But most fish farms are based in the open ocean, which causes serious pollution and is endangering wild fish stocks, particularly of related species. Open-ocean fish farms are a very bad thing.

If you can find 'the book of new alchemists' i believe it gives fairly good instructions for fishfarming on land - breeds such as tilapia

[Green Aura]

fishfarming on land

. Eh???????

I understand your problem, Thomas, going to the supermarket can be an ethical nightmare. I think it comes back to being Ish - doing what you can in your given circumstances. When we lived in Manchester, on a much higher income, we only bought organic, fairtrade etc. But then we didn't grow as much as I would have liked mainly because we both worked. I'm afraid now, even though health as well as ethical concerns worry me, we've had to go back to less expensive stuff.

Having said that I try to see it all as part of a bigger picture - we eat far more simply, with much less meat. I only buy British, preferably Scottish, meat and get the best I can afford. We try to grow any of the more likely to be imported stuff (although with mixed success up here) and try to buy seasonally. I've even bought hooks, line and sinkers and fully intend having a go at catching some fish - at some point I think our "footprint" must be much lighter - and not just carbon - now because our overall consumption is so much less, even though we can't salve our consciences with organic etc.

[boboff]

I agree its ish all the way.

The John Seymour Book is a classic, and the bits on Allotment work could be the answer to your dilema.

Food Miles for me is key. But even growing your own meat, you need to feed them and the food comes from all over. If you are lucky enough to have a big lot of land to grow your own animal feed then you need a tractor and machinery, which are all huge resources.

[bonniethomas06]

I know what you mean - I went through a similar phase earlier this year and got myself in a complete tizz about it all. For me, Supermarkets are the root of all evil - without them we would pay more for our food to smaller producers who would in turn have less of an impact on the planet than huge agri-businesses; we would be less wasteful (because it costs more) and have less choice - which I think is a good thing - I simply don't need to choose from 6 varieties of tinned peach. I also think we would be less overweight as a nation, because supermarkets induce us to buy products we don't need and wouldn't otherwise have bought. There would be less packaging clogging up the sea and landfill, because supermarkets have tricked us into thinking that packaging=hygene. Also, there would be less exploitation in the world because smaller businesses means less buying power - and little coffee/green bean/vanilla farmers all over the world would be able to turn down the lower paid work. The list is endless, in my opinion.

So, for me, I now completely avoid supermarkets - and I think the way to live a less damaging lifestyle is to buy locally, mainly eat things in season, eat meat sparingly and waste as little as possible, and to encourage other people to do the same.

And don't beat yourself up if you slip up now and again...in this world it is impossible to do anything 100%...so long as you do your best.

Ooh, sorry, turned into a rant.

[grahamhobbs]

Life is a compromise, we don't control everything, the society we live in doesn't share all our values. The important thing is to be healthy, a sick vegan is no help to anyone, a sick meat eater is even worse. Next we ought to try to make a healthy planet, so eating locally makes sense, eating homegrown is even better and the excercise keeps you healthy.

Obviously avoiding processed foods, meat reared in unhealthy conditions, endangered fish, etc helps both your health and the planets. In practice it is all a compromise but to me eating healthly is helping to create a healthy world.

[frozenthunderbolt]

fishfarming on land

. Eh???????

AS in creating your own enclosures and pond systems, be they synthetics or the better glee (gl-AY) ponds in which to breed fish raising them on scraps and/alge/insects - tend to the muddy like catfish but if you purge them before eating apparently ok and fairly ethical as far as it goes.

[Susie]

I went through this as well. My short answer is: I agree with everything Bonnie said although I'm not as good at avoiding supermarkets but am getting better. I will spare you my longer answer because it was quite a long process!

[Jessiebean]

I remember reading that anyone who worries that they are a bad parent isn't one- bad parents wouldn't ever think about it! So if you are worrying about having an Un-ethical diet it is going to be a pretty good one!My point is I do think that the key is being aware and not obsessive. I do buy beans etc from India, mnay of the farmers over there need our support too or they would starve so even though the food miles aren't great the dried beans are better than the processed ones. I am not a vegetarian but I don't eat land animals, I have given up on "unethical fish" (tinned tuna, random "white fish" products from stupormarketetc) and I am eating only Tasmanian seafood which means I only eat it when I go out. Paul the Octopus and our Australian Oracle Octopus (Predicted an election would be called today.. and it was...) have had me discussing the merits of the Cephlapods with my wise husband and although I am unsure of their psychic ability they are too intelligent for me to justify eating them so I might as well be vego for all the flesh food I feel is allowable!
I have found that being aware has lead to a natural evolution of my diet towrds a more ethical one- not forcing myself and getting more stressed in the process.. a girl has gotta eat ya know!
PS. The Wise husband has added that if you stress out too much about an unethical diet you will turn to comfort eating and binge on Blood Diamonds and maltreated Indigenous peoples.So there.

[kit-e-kate]

Perhaps you could find a little time to forage in and around your local area? Its good fun and surely must be the shortest route from nature to plate! : )