Seitan

[hedgewitch]

Yeah I've heard of the process of rinsing the dough, it's how it was done originally.
Not tried it myself. Have you made it this way before Maggie?

[Green Aura]

Here's the recipe - can't remember where I got it. This is the recipe I used the first time I made seitan and even though it was hard work (and cold on your hands) it was really tasty.
Sorry Lady willow but it does take quite a lot of water to clear the starch - I don't know if you could use it for some other purpose rather than throwing it away.

14 cups water (more may be needed)
¾ cup tamari soy sauce
3 fresh garlic cloves, crushed or finely minced
½ yellow onion, finely chopped
½ celery rib or stalk, finely chopped
1 tablespoon fresh grated ginger root
1 (3-inch long) piece of kombu (a type of seaweed) (optional)
8 cups whole-wheat flour

1. In a large pot over high heat bring 10½ cups of water to boil. Add tamari,
garlic, onion, celery, ginger and kombu cooking over low heat and continue to simmer
for 25 minutes. Set timer.

2. In a large bowl combine flour and the 3½ remaining cups of the measured water
stirring to make firm but not sticky dough adding a little more water if necessary so
it is not too dry.

3. Knead dough by hand on a smooth flat surface for at least 10 to 12 minutes until
it has an elastic consistency.

4. Place the dough in a large bowl filling up the bowl with semi warm water until
the dough is completely underwater and let it rest for 25 minutes.

5. After the dough has rested, put the bowl with the dough and water in the sink
and knead it by hand until the water turns cloudy and starchy white. Drain the milky
water replacing it with fresh cold water and knead until the water becomes milky.
Repeat this process several times until the water remains clear after kneading and the
dough becomes firmer and more elastic.

6. Place the rinsed and drained seitan in a dry bowl and let it rest for 30 minutes
before cooking.

7. Cut seitan into smaller chunks and place it in the broth. Simmer over low heat
for 1½ hours. The seitan should remain underwater. Do not let it come to boil. Continue
to reduce heat if necessary. Set timer.

8. Store the seitan in its broth in a tightly covered container and keep
refrigerated. Use within a week or freeze with or without broth.

[hedgewitch]

Thanks for posting that.
I've made seitan numerous times now (making some this afternoon in fact) and I find baking the dough to be SO much better than boiling.
Boiling makes it too watery for my liking - I like a denser, dryer seitan that baking gives.

Just my personal preference though.

[Odsox]

T
Here's the casserole recipe for you anyway

Ingredients
200g Seitan
Olive oil
1 large carrot, peeled and sliced
2 rings green bell pepper, sliced
2 rings red bell pepper, sliced
1 small onion, thinly sliced
1 clove garlic, diced
8 medium mushrooms, quartered
1 pint vegetable broth
half teaspoon Italian Herbs
half teaspoon Marmite
1 Tblsp Bisto Gravy Granules
salt and pepper to taste

I may be a bit dense and I certainly have no wish to offend, but my Bisto gravy granules contain 'beef extract' and the chicken gravy granules contain 'chicken fat' and also egg.
I assume there are vegetarian gravy granules ?

It would make sense for me to be a vegetarian but I like fried bacon rashers too much.

[Berti]

when I used to be a vegetarian (please don't boo me....I am changing) I also used to make my own seitan from scratch.
the best results I got was using whole wheat flour, as this has the most gluten development, at least, that is my experience.

the best buy I EVER did was getting the cookbook from the famous The Farm commune in USA, who were all vegans when they began.
they do, as far as I know, still have a website and a health food shop, selling the most yummy vegan (soy based) stuff.
from that book I learnt how to make seitan, and it what you get in pots from the health food store is NOTHING compared to it.
it is completely different stuff.

and oh yeah, I was also one of these who liked the baked seitan gluten, especially the seitan barbequed ribs!!!
I still have my vegetarian/ vegan books, and I do eat vegetarian some weekdays.

I highly recommend either make your own or use the vital wheat gluten mix.
also very nice when cooled and then sliced on a sandwich!

all of a sudden I feel a need to visit those sites again....
if need any info, feel free to contact me.

berti

[hedgewitch]

That's alright Odsox no offence taken and you're certainly not dense for asking questions.
There are two types of Bisto gravy granules and one is suitable for vegetarians whilst the other isn't. If my memory serves me well - it's the Bisto "Best" brand that is unsuitable, but don't quote me on that as I don't buy it so I can't check it.

Bisto Original and Bisto Onion are both suitable for vegetarians, but they are the only two (unless they make a veggie one like Oxo do).

I make a HUGE batch of seitan every week, yes even in this stiffling heat. It is just so easy and one million times better than shop bought. I love the versatility of it and it can be stored easily in the freezer.

Berti - I've never made seitan from whole wheat flour. That's the process that involves a LOT of rinsing with water isn't it?
I'm far too lazy for that and just buy gluten flour from the health food store.

[Berti]

hehe hedgewitch........oh yes it is hard work.
though the amount of water is not as bad as you think.
I really liked the results......

and I have tried the vital wheat gluten too, they sell it now (only ONE website) here in netherlands but out of stock a lot.
of course, in these modern times, we are jused to "just add water" *smirk* and it IS so very handy.
I am not going to say making it yourself is cheaper.
It is not........from a kilo of whole wheat you really don't get a whole lot of the stuff, so the vital wheat is cheaper.
Now if I could get it in bulk for a good price, I would consider that now and then to use to cook with.
here is a website that sells it in bulk http://www.healthy-eating.com (hope this is right.) it is the shop from the earlier mentioned the Farm. There also is a website from the manufacturer where you can get it cheaper http://www.bobsredmill.com.
If anyone with a creditcard gets weird ideas in their head, maybe we could do a bulk order? (low dollar)

greetings
berti

[Graye]

Having grumbled about not being able to find anything like quorn, seitan, TVP etc in France we went shopping this week in our local BioCoop where I found lots of ready-prepared veggie dishes. I was more than slightly amazed as there is vary rarely anything more than very suspect "soyaburgers" (for which read rubber burgers) in most of the chains of supermarkets in France.

Here's what I bought, which is about to accompany a mushroom balti, naan bread and boiled basmati for dinner tonight. Mmm!!!!!!!!!

[hedgewitch]

How splendid for you.

As an ex pat myself - I totally know and understand how frustrating it is not being able to buy veggie food with the same ease as in the UK. I appreciate these little victories so much.

[the.fee.fairy]

Still haven;t given this a go...

So...if i managed to get VWG (can't find a source at the moment..), then it wouldn't need to be washed, but if i use strong flour (got some of that on the shelf) then i would need to wash it.

And...excuse the silly question, but why doesn't it fall apart in water? I'm thinking of it like a bread dough/pizza dough typ texture, and that'd fall apart in water...wouldn't it?!

[Graye]

It doesn't fall apart at all. I'm not sure why but it just stays in a mass, getting more and more elastic as you go with the washing. I'm usually quite gentle with it and let the water drain off constantly by using a tilted bowl. also letting the water trickle rather than gush to begin with. I think the secret of this is to follow the recipe, especially the bit about letting it stand for a while, also not letting the dough become to wet while mixing in the water - it needs to be quite a firm consistency.

It's quite a chore really but the result is worthwhile!

[barefootlinzi]

so is there no where online in the uk we can get gluten flour? How annoying!

I have all the ingredients to make it myself except celery and we have normal soy sauce not tamari, would this make much difference? If not i will give it a go today

[hedgewitch]

It does seem to be a problem to find Gluten Flour in the UK yes.
I only know this because members from the veggie forums I frequent have told me.

The ironic thing is that I can get it easily, I have an EXCELLENT local health food shop.
I would ask the manager of your local HFS - they are always willing to oblige (well...mostly).

[barefootlinzi]

Well i have just made my seitan, it is in the broth cooking as we speak. I used the rinse method and was worried as i kneaded it underwater because it seemed to be coming apart in my hands.Then i put it in a metal small holed colinder and trickled the water onto it as i kneaded and that was much better, it became a firm, elastic dough much quicker. It is half the size once it is rinsed! Now i have to decide what to cook it in tonight...... Will let you know how it tastes

[barefootlinzi]

well i must have done it wrong cause it was awful!! The texture was loose and spongy, it tasted of flour and there was lots of bran in it from the whole wheat flour, maybe i should have used a different flour. All that work and it was inedible

Any idea where i went wrong?