Finland Finland Finland...

[bonniethomas06]

I am thinking of learning a second langugage. I have always wanted to be fluent in a language other than english and I think it is a bit shameful that we brits (most of us anyway) never bother.

But more than anything, I am stunned at the research I have read which shows how much learning another language is great for your brain and can stave of nasty things like alzheimers.

I like a challenge, so it was a toss up between welsh and finnish - the latter because I am mildly obsessed with Finland and have an invite to go there next year - and have romantic notions of moving there one day - plus it is supposed to be one of the hardest european languages to learn. I tried as a sort of taster, to learn the Finnish 1-10 and I am AMAZED at how my brain was so slow to pick it up, I have just basically forgotten how to learn.

So a rather random question...has anyone had any experience of Finland in general, or learning the language as a second language? There is a saturday school in Bristol and a good friend of mine is Finnish, so hopefully would have lots of support.

Hei Hei!

[contadina]

I know several people who have married Finns, and all I know is that it is one of the most difficult languages to learn because it has 64 cases and a grammar structure unlike any other European language. Good like with your brain challenge.

[Green Aura]

My brother has lived in Finland for the last 6-7 years and has so far failed to pass the mandatory language course! Don't take that as any indication of its difficulty though.

I'm not sure the spoken language is too difficult - I picked up a few words in the 4 days I was there, but writing it appears to be a different story. Lots of double letters but I can't work out how, if at all, it changes the pronunciation or part of speech etc.

Welsh, on the other hand, I spoke fairly fluently for about a year - while I was using it regularly. Now I can just about remember how to order a coffee or buy a newspaper. All the vocabulary's gone into the ether somewhere.

I suppose my point is it's great to learn a new language but unless you're going to use it fairly regularly it will be just a brain exercise.

[The Riff-Raff Element]

In learning a language, the most important thing is being able to practice it: it's no good spending two hours a week in a classroom and that being the end of it. In some ways, therefore, Welsh might be a better choice. It is a native British language and there are loads of speakers. You have TV and radio in Welsh easily available and travel to Wales is a heck of a lot cheaper than going to Finland.

[bonniethomas06]

Good points about the practice of it - althoguh there must be Finnish books/websites/magazines and films you can get here? And failing that I can go next door and make my poor finnish friend listen to my stuttering pidgeon Finnish! She has given me some childrens books and picture books that she used to teach her ex-husband Finnish, so I think it is winning the race at the moment.

Jon are you now fluent in French? HOw long did it take?

[The Riff-Raff Element]

Jon are you now fluent in French? HOw long did it take?

Yes. But I'd say that I am still learning. I'm past the level of spoken French that would be necessary for a degree in French, but I still find that however much I know I could still improve my ways of expressing myself. I suppose I became passerbly fluent in about three years - that was the point by which I could spend an entire day speaking French without feeling wrung out by the end of it. It would have been quicker if I'd been working in a French speaking environment, but I was working from home and working with another English speaker.

Even after nine years I realise that my accent will always be there (though English people hearing me speak often comment that I sound French my French friends make no such mistake) and I will always have some idiosyncrasies of expression and pronunciation. This no longer bothers me.

I learned Dutch years ago and was working in a Dutch-speaking office. I became a functional Dutch speaker in about 12 weeks and fluent in written & spoken Dutch within six months. It can be that quick, in the right environment.

I would add that I'm not a great linguist: I have little natural talent and don't enjoy the process of learning. If I can do it, anyone can.

That said, I am going to embark on learning Latin from September: middle daughter has taken the Latin option for next year and I've always felt a hankering to know the language, so I'm going to follow along her course with her.

[Susie]

Go Bonnie! I have googled Finnish grammatical structure and I am taking my hat of to you (if you're interested in a language though, that's more than half the battle!)

[Thomzo]

Good for you. Sounds as if you have a chance to practice with your neighbour so why not? It's not as if you need to pass an exam or anything so if it becomes too hard you can always move to something else. Once you've mastered it a bit, why not see if you can set up a conversation group at a local pub. Advertise for people who are Finnish or who are learning it and meet up to talk about anything and everything as long as you talk in Finnish.

Jon, I was forced to do Latin at school and hated it. Part of the problem was that none of our teachers was qualified to teach it so they were learning and then passing it on to us. I couldn't understand why we were doing it. It's only since I left school that I have begun to realise just how much so many languages have borrowed from it and that understanding Latin can help you to understand words you don't know and learn other European languages. I wish the teachers had explained that to me at school.

Zoe

[Zech]

If you chose Welsh it might spur me on to learn

That said, I love Scandinavia and would love to be able to speak one of the languages. I think Danish, Swedish and Norwegian have quite a lot in common, whereas Finnish is more distinct.

[Starfaun]

I love Scandinavia and would love to be able to speak one of the languages. I think Danish, Swedish and Norwegian have quite a lot in common, whereas Finnish is more distinct.

You're right! I'm Swedish and I understand both Danish and Norwegian and a bit of Icelandic, but Finnish... Er, nope, not a word!

As for "experience", I used to be able to say "a lot of snow, but no torch light" in Finnish, but I forgot. But then again I didn't really use it much.

[the.fee.fairy]

Is it Finnish that has no please and thank you?

I know my sister can order 4 beers in finnish...her Hockey coach is finnish and taught her that when they went to the pub. She doesn't know any other number because there were four of them there at the time :)

Ooh...check out Regretsy, they have a bit of a Finnish obsession.

OOOH!!!! I do know how to say I love HIM! (HIM are Finnish and possibly me most favouritest band ever...someone taught me how to say I love HIM at a concert once...) And I can sing a Finnish song. Can't remember what song it is in English. I'll dig it out. I do know it's by Ville Valo and Agents (Mr Valo being the lead singer of HIM - hence me having the song...).

[oldjerry]

[quote="the.fee.fairy"]Is it Finnish that has no please and thank you?

NOPE......That's teenage in all languages............

[bonniethomas06]

Go Bonnie! I have googled Finnish grammatical structure and I am taking my hat of to you (if you're interested in a language though, that's more than half the battle!)

oh god, I just did too and wish I hadn't. Am going to wait until my teach-yourself-finnish arrives before I start to panic though.

Thanks Jon, it was interesting to read your reply. I really think that it is about training your brain - I couldn't believe yesterday how I could re-write the numbers 1-10 about eight times, be able to recite it and then after half an hour doing something else, it had disappeared! But today it seems to have come back. I am working on the idea that your mind is like an athlete's body - the more you train the easier it gets. Lets hope so eh?

[Odsox]

HIM are Finnish and possibly me most favouritest band ever

Ah now, I actually quite like the Leningrad Cowboys and they're Finnish ... with tractor shaped guitars and with the Red Army Choir as a backing group.
But that's about it as far as Finland goes.

Welsh on the other hand being a Celtic language, if you learnt that you would be half way fluent in Irish Gaeilge, Scots Gaelic and Breton as well.

[trinder]

Hi, Having support from someone who is a native speaker may actually be a bit of a poisoned chalice.
I befriended a Lithuanian woman and our friendship was strong but I never really got to broach the complex subject of empathy.
One day I explained to her, that my eldest sister had had a stroke ( we discussed and she understood) I added that her only daughter was quite dependant on her for much of her social interactions, i.e. she took her shopping and to the bingo. My friend listened attentively and checked out her understanding at regular intervals, then exclaimed "nothing to be done" which although true was not an appropriate response but I just nodded.

I hasten to add. All is well (ish) with my sister but we all have a regular stock phrase when someone tells you of their misfortune

"nothing to be done"