Opinions needed!

[the.fee.fairy]

I'm having an argument online with some people and I wanted to get some other opinions...

Would you advertise for free for your company?

As you all know, I live in China. I teach here.
A lot of the schools want to use the 'foreign face' for advertising. I don't agree with it and would never do any kind of advertising work for free for them. Some people I'm arguing with say that as a foreigner, you're special and therefore SHOULD advertise for the school that has 'welcomed' you.

What do you think? If your company asked you to have your photo taken for their advertising, or asked you to hand out flyers for them on a Saturday afternoon...for free, would you do it?

[Rosendula]

If the company was struggling financially I would do it for free in order to try to get more business in, thereby protecting my own job. On the other hand, if the company was just being greedy and wanted to use me for free instead of paying someone else to do it, I wouldn't do it on principle as I would feel like I was taking the opportunity of paid work away from someone else.

[Green Aura]

Hmm, a couple of things spring to mind.

1) Is it a cultural difference - I can't imagine anyone over here believing they're special for having been welcomed to a job. A job is a contract where you provide your service/labour and they pay you. It may be seen differently in China, so I suppose you need to take that into account

2) At the risk of falling foul of the "big society" ethos (which thankfully seems to have slipped on its 4rse ) I'm not a big exponent of volunteering. If there's a job to be done then someone should be paid for it. But that's just my view and loads of people seem happy to give up their Saturday mornings to leaflet or get their 15 minutes by being in a poster or brochure for free. I suppose that bit should be up to the individual - but it worries me that what starts off as voluntary then becomes expected and the one's who don't volunteer become vilified.

[Lost-in-the-Day]

I'm having an argument online with some people and I wanted to get some other opinions...

Would you advertise for free for your company?

As you all know, I live in China. I teach here.
A lot of the schools want to use the 'foreign face' for advertising. I don't agree with it and would never do any kind of advertising work for free for them. Some people I'm arguing with say that as a foreigner, you're special and therefore SHOULD advertise for the school that has 'welcomed' you.

What do you think? If your company asked you to have your photo taken for their advertising, or asked you to hand out flyers for them on a Saturday afternoon...for free, would you do it?

I've never lived in China so don't know what cultural differences there may be when it comes to something like this but over here I certainly wouldn't work for free, not unless I thought I was in danger of losing my job if I didn't. If my photo was to be taken for advertising I would insist that there was some sort of paperwork laying out the terms and conditions for using my picture for marketing purposes which I would need to agree to and sign before they took my picture.

And as for handing out flyers for free? There is nothing in my job contract about being under any obligation to work for free and would refuse to do it unless I was paid overtime.


If this is an online argument only it may be best to just walk away...arguments on the internet always cause more grief than they are worth.

[the.fee.fairy]

I probably should have been clearer - I was arguing with an American...

There is an element of being 'special' here, but as soon as you make it known that you just want to live, do your job and learn people are nice and stop treating you specially. Obviously, there are a lot of things i need help for, and I'm well aware that sometimes having a white face helps these things along a bit (like the bank).

There are a load of westerners here who stop all the time and have stupid photos taken with everyone and take full advantage of the white face syndrome. Personally, I hate it. I want the Chinese to realise that even a white face is a person and we're all the same.

[Zech]

When I was a university lecturer (UK) this sort of thing was par for the course. We just accepted it as part of the job. I don't suppose any of the students featured in the publicity material got paid for it either. Foreign faces were strongly favoured there, too.

We got much more annoyed about being asked to work at the weekends for open days, than the occasional photographer wanting posed shots of classes in progress.

[MKG]

I'm not quite sure of your situation, fee.

If you are working for a specialist TEFL organisation who make their money from the application of your talents, then no, you should certainly not allow them to use you for free.

If, on the other hand, you're working at an ordinary Chinese school, then I'd say that you should allow them to photograph you - they're hardly going to be a profit centre in their own right.

Mike

[gregorach]

What do you think? If your company asked you to have your photo taken for their advertising, or asked you to hand out flyers for them on a Saturday afternoon...for free, would you do it?

Kinda depends on your definition of "free" I guess... It has been known for my attendance to be "strongly encouraged" at certain corporate events, for networking and relationship management purposes - but such events usually involve a decent feed and copious amounts of free booze. On the flip side, it does mean at least suit and tie, and there's no clothing allowance. I'll be picking up a dinner suit from the tailors next month, solely for these sorts of events, so in a sense I'm actually paying for the privilege... On the other flip side, it's not like they don't pay me well enough.

Not quite the same as advertising to punters though.

[Pumpkin&Piglet]

This isn't the same situation but might be useful to you.

I had my photo taken for brochures when I was a student for university and also provided stories and photographs for local papers (for their gain, not my own) and in every single case was totally misquoted and actually often they quite simply made something up about me.

This made me look like a total twat in nearly every case and I didn't like it. Enough so that I won't be doing it anymore but it didn't bother me enough to do anything else about it.

It depends on the situation as to what is right to do - and on opinion of course - but my point is think about any affect it may have. If you're expected to do it for free, what else are you expected to be ok with? Them using the picture or what you've said out of context? No matter what the resulting image of you is?

In a situation when you do something for free it's also likely the whole experience is pretty lax and others might not take the care with your image that you would yourself.

Sorry if this isn't relevant, hope it helps if it is

[Thomzo]

I've been involved in preparing corporate brochures and accounts for years. It was quite normal to include pictures of staff in them. The photos were taken during working hours, so it was never 'for free' but nobody was ever forced and if they didn't like having their photo taken, that was fine.

If your school wants to show that it is an inclusive, multi-cultural environment and have asked you to for your photo then it is entirely up to you whether you want to do it or not.

As for handing out leaflets at the weekend, again it should be voluntary and it depends on the circumstances. In my role, unpaid overtime is the norm, or perhaps I should say a certain amount of work outside the nine-to-five is included within my daily rate.

Zoe

[the.fee.fairy]

Thanks for the opinions everyone!

The person I was arguing with became quite rude and offensive, so I've bowed out gracefully from any further discussion...

My school only asks me to go to different government functions with them to show that they have a foreign teacher. I don't mind these.

I get treated very well by my company. They leave me to my own devices most of the time. I think if they asked me to leaflet, I might have something to say about it, but the odd photo and the odd translation I don't mind.

Funnily enough P&P that is probably closest to the situations most foreign teachers face here!! They use the faces and then make up something about them. Usually it's written in Chinese so unless you can get someone to translate it, you'll never know what they wrote...

In my last place, we went to visit a a school and the head of dept. who took us there just made up things when we met people. I think he told someone that I liked skiing and watching DVDs...which are totally not my favourite things to do!

[oldjerry]

Interesting thread for me,I spent months doing a CELTA at Cheltenham a couple of years ago with the idea of making an extra Euro or two when we were in Italy.Loved the course,but became very wary of some of the potential worldwide employers who regularly advertised on college boards.I'm sure some are brilliant,and your's sound ok.

On the other hand,nobody in their right mind,from any culture, creed or race would use my mug to advertise anything.

[the.fee.fairy]

I wish I had the cash for a CELTA!!

Mostly, the golden rule is Avoid Training Schools. These are private operations and seem to play by their own rules.
I'm not sure about European institutions, but in China (and most of Asia) it's best to go with a government place, like a public university.

I'm in a public University now. It means that the contract you have is a standard government contract that guarantees certain things. It also means that if you have a problem, you can take it to the top at the Government, rather than fighting a local character. The contracts are covered by SAFEA (can't remember what it stands for...) which is the government authority. It means that your school is licensed to have a Foreign Teacher, they have been vetted by the government as being suitable, and they can make sure you have the right visa. It also means that if there's a problem, I can go to SAFEA themselves at the government and get things sorted out.

Usually, just avoid any private schools owned by private individuals and you'll be in a much better position. Also do a lot of research online. There are loads of EFL and ESL websites that have blacklists for around the world - Dave's ESL Cafe is a good one. They're well respected and they have a massive worldwide blacklist.

The big two to avoid here are English First and WEB English. They're franchises, usually owned by shady characters that have the money (and tend to want to keep it rather than paying their teachers).