Tomatoes for low light levels ?

[Odsox]

Sorry, this may be a bit rambling.

I am growing 9 different varieties of tomato (not a patch on Jon I know) and some of them are doing OK, but some of them are showing signs of not being very happy.
The variety that's most unhappy is Paul Robeson, a black (obviously) Ukrainian or Russian tomato of the same line as Black Russian. They were planted out in the greenhouse in mid March and grew away strongly. The first two trusses on every plant are now full of large healthy fruits, but after that there are 6 trusses with no tomatoes at all, not one. The Black Russians that I'm also growing are similar but do have a few fruits on trusses further up, and the Tommy Toe plants are one stage better, not good but better. All three varieties look leggy and drawn from the second truss up, which leads me to suspect that the problem is light levels.
A quick look at the weather data for my nearest weather station (Valentia Island) have the temperatures for March to June as being at or slightly above average, but the sunshine totals are quite interesting.
March 142% above average, April 114% above average, May 76% below average and June 64% below average

Now all the other varieties are fine, growing as expected along side of the suffering varieties in the same two greenhouse, including the oddball un-named mystery variety that I mentioned in another thread, and the most healthy looking plants, which are loaded with fruit on every truss, are Ferline.
I have no idea where the other varieties originated from but the Ferline is an F1 variety that has been bred to be blight resistant, and I assume that tomato blight resistance is really only relevant to the damp British Isles, with the suffering varieties heirlooms from places that have better brighter summers than here.
The Paul Robeson produced full trusses when the sunshine levels were above 100% and failed totally when they were below 100%, which of course may have no correlation whatsoever and just be a coincidence, but maybe worth thinking about when I choose next year's varieties. Do I choose varieties bred specifically for northern latitudes and forget those southern ones, or take a chance and hope we have a more "normal" summer next year ?
Sorry for the ramble, I thought it was interesting anyway.

[Green Aura]

Well it's particularly interesting for me too, Tony. I hadn't even thought about it - other than we'd have a problem achieving your 12 month tomatoes growing because of the lack of light here between October and March.

We bought our tomato plants this year, as we didn't know for certain we'd have anywhere to grow them so didn't plant any. The garden centre only had very few options - beefsteak, a beef tomato; moneymaker and a tiny patio tomato, whose name escapes me. Maybe they're more suited to up here.

In previous years we've not had particularly good results from San Marzano or re pear, but more success with cherry tomatoes.

[oldjerry]

I think we've touched on something similar before(may have been dreaming) surely the only way you're going to find out,is to INCREASE the light levels..nowhere near as difficult or expensive as you might think (turbine\batteries or whatever).

[Green Aura]

I know, OJ, but if I can find the best performers for our conditions then we're off to a better start with or without the additional light.

The seedlings come on just fine, on a SW facing windowsill in the house, in January, so they must be sufficient light to grow.

[oldjerry]

Hmmm...I should know this (but don't) surely big growing plant needs more light than a seedling. Anyhow obviously I got the wrong end of the stick,and of course you need to find the best variety for your conditions....so here's my suggestion,,probably not been available since 1965... Sub Arctic Plenty..used to be the only outside variety recommended for t'North.(Could try heritage seeds) Under a tunnel should fruit in Greenland.

[Green Aura]

Just found it on Fothergills and several other seed sites. Thanks for that - 42 days! Sounds like our summer ( some years)

[diggernotdreamer]

Not an expert, but if there are trusses and no tomatoes that have formed perhaps they did not get pollinated and the flowers just dropped off. Do you get many bees in your greenhouse?, do you grow flowers to attract pollinators into your greenhouse. Check out The Real Seed company, they have lots of really interesting varieties for our climate, I grow a lot of theirs and have tomatoes to eat from the end of May and a storing tomato that keeps really well into the middle of January.

[Odsox]

here's my suggestion,,probably not been available since 1965... Sub Arctic Plenty..used to be the only outside variety recommended for t'North.(Could try heritage seeds) Under a tunnel should fruit in Greenland.

I grew Sub Arctic Plenty a few years back and it grew OK, but the flavour was only so-so.
Sorry Maggie, I should have thought about low light varieties before I started banging on about growing them over winter. So, varieties that I have so far successfully grown in winter are, Totem and Megabite both suitable for growing in pots, Sub Artic Plenty (mine suffered from foot rot when I tried it hydroponically), Tommy Toe, Tigerella (and probably it's cousins Craigella, Tangella and especially Ailsa Craig) and Ferline (very strong growing).
In light of what I posted earlier, it's probably wise to steer clear of black and purple varieties.

[Odsox]

Not an expert, but if there are trusses and no tomatoes that have formed perhaps they did not get pollinated and the flowers just dropped off. Do you get many bees in your greenhouse?, do you grow flowers to attract pollinators into your greenhouse.

Good point, except that like true scientific experiments I have a control specimen(s). There are 4 other varieties growing in the same greenhouse that are all growing as normal and loaded with fruit all the way to the top.

Check out The Real Seed company, they have lots of really interesting varieties for our climate, I grow a lot of theirs and have tomatoes to eat from the end of May and a storing tomato that keeps really well into the middle of January.

I have bought their seeds in the past including their storage tomato (which unfortunately is pretty tasteless), but unless the Real Seed Company have changed their policy, I can't justify (or afford) paying £8.50 for delivering a packet of seed to Ireland when other seed companies charge 95p

[diggernotdreamer]

I had forgotten about the expensive postage to here. I live 20 miles from the border so I get mine sent to a Royal Mail post office and a friend picks up my post. I would be more than happy to share seeds as I save mine from year to year so my purchase 3 years ago is still going strong. Sorry you didn't like the De Colgar, I thought they were lovely, especially if they were cooked as very little juice came out of them, they were very sweet, gave some away and people raved about them, which just shows tomato flavour is very subjective. I keep Latah, Urbikany, De Colgar, Amish Paste, Broad ripple yellow currant, Tibet Appel, Japanese Black Triffele, Aurora, Irish Gardeners Delight, Sunray Gold, Auntie Madge and a big finned one that I just call Spanish as I bought it in a market and liked it so much I saved seed and have grown it since. Have you a photo of your toms growing in the greenhouse, always interested to see what other peoples setups look like, I don't get out much :)

[Odsox]

Sorry you didn't like the De Colgar, I thought they were lovely, especially if they were cooked as very little juice came out of them, they were very sweet,

Strange how tastes vary isn't it, but then I find Moneymaker bland where others think they taste nice. I have to say that my personal preferences for tomato taste are the high acid types, like Gardeners Delight.
You probably don't know but I grow fresh ripe tomatoes on my window sill all year round, so storage tomatoes in January are not so much of a treat when you can pick fresh ones. You can read the whole saga of my tomato growing from here backwards

I'd be very interested to hear how your heirloom tomatoes are growing this year in this dreary weather, although if I remember right you have had a little more sun in the north this spring than we've had down here. I'm waiting for Met Eireann to release their solar radiation figures for this year, they have only got to April so far.

[diggernotdreamer]

I did try growing indoor tomatoes about 10 years ago and they got wall to wall aphids, but I didn't sow new seed, I rooted some sideshoots. Do you get any aphids on the indoor stuff??, they may have caught them off my citrus trees, which have now died from being exposed to -21 here in 2010. I HATE moneymakers. We have had better weather up here this year, which makes a change for us to get the good weather. Last year it pee'd down from June to December, nearly every day rain, we had five days in July when it didn't rain and we just managed to get hay made. So it may be of interest to you that I had bumper crops of tomatoes, sweetcorn, french beans, butternut squash and calabrese the size of footballs (in the tunnel of course), I spent days bottling passata, must just be my sunny disposition

[The Riff-Raff Element]

...and I assume that tomato blight resistance is really only relevant to the damp British Isles, with the suffering varieties heirlooms from places that have better brighter summers than here.

I wish it were! Currently battling a blight episode following a downpour last Friday. Happily I had Bordeaux mixture on hand when I first spotted symptoms and was merrily spraying in the rain. I think I've contained it, but I've probably lost at least 30% of the fruit. I hate spraying without good cause, but from next season I'm going to adopt a preventative regime, whatever the weather.

[diggernotdreamer]

[I'd be very interested to hear how your heirloom tomatoes are growing this year in this dreary weather, although if I remember right you have had a little more sun in the north this spring than we've had down here. I'm waiting for Met Eireann to release their solar radiation figures for this year, they have only got to April so far.

Thought you might be interested in my tomatoes progress seeing as I am in Ireland although in Leitrim. The Aurora, Irish Gardeners Delight, Urbikany, Russian Black and Spanish have all produced really well, the Aurora has produced huge fruits, all the supports I put in for them have been flattened by the sheer weight of tomatoes. We have had some awful weather, it got a lot better on Tuesday up until yesterday when it rained and was overcast. Tibet Appel, Sunray Gold, Amish Paste and De Colgar have yet to start ripening fully, but all the others have ripened really well and I have picked loads for bottling and Irish Gardeners Delight have been providing us with cherry toms for a number of weeks now. Latah is nearly finished, they were ripening by the end of May, although last year we picked our first few at the end of April, as you probably know, this is one developed by the University of Moscow in Oregon for the short growing season they have there, we think it has a very good flavour.

[Odsox]

Thanks for that. I haven't grown Latah as I really prefer indeterminate cordon varieties, bush ones tend to annoy me by wanting horizontal space when there is plenty of vertical space available. What does it taste like compared to the Gardener's Delight ?

I am planning to grow Amish Paste next year, so I would be very interested in how your's turn out. I know they are a late variety, but as long as there are not too many green ones left at the end of the season, it doesn't really matter too much for a bottling variety. I'm already choosing what I want to grow next year, still looking for that certain tomato that ticks all the boxes, still looking for one with the high acid/high sugar flavour like G. Delight but with bigger fruit. Maybe next year I will find it.