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<B>Hi All, I Have already got Kunekune pigs,chickens,ducks and geese and have been looking at a couple of dairy goats for a while, obviously id have to get two for company so say a nanny in kid would be okay because as soon as she gave birth she would have the kids for company? would that work? or a nanny with kid at foot? would that work? And are these often available? Just wondering if anyone can supply me with some information on dairy goats, particularly like golden gurnseys, any information at all would be greatly appreciated even if its down to how many pound of food or something they eat a day. thanks Joe </b>

Hi, we breed British Alpine Dairy Goats in Australia. I do agree with having two, which can be two unrelated or a doe with a kid or kids at foot (bearing in mind how much milk you need - you may need to separate the kid at night with some breeds that don't produce a lot of milk) works ok. A doe in kid may be a bit of an issue as she would be very lonely until the kid was born and you maybe wouldn't want to travel her late in pregnancy. I have a lot of info on our web site www.sarariver.com (see link below) about dairy goats if you want to have a look. Happy to answer any questions.

The amount of food would vary enormously with the amount of milk produced, the season (i.e., more food required in the cold) how often you milk (if milking twice per day more feed would be required) as well as if the goat was also providing for a kid and of course what natural foods are available. It is good to remember that goats are browsers that eat some grass and many a goat has become very poor in condition if only grass is available. Most commercial feed has recommended feeding rates on the bags and it does vary quite a bit. A goat also requires quite a lot of roughage which can be supplied either from natural habitat (browsing branches) and grass or can be added by feeding not too rich hay.

Breeds are a very personal thing. We eventually chose to breed British Alpines partly because of their temperament (although availability did have something to do with the final choice) and the fact that they are not hard on fences. I like the Togenburgs too but they are really cheeky and from visiting a stud, also a bit harder on fences. Cute though. Can't help with the golden gurnseys though. I have had Saanens (?spelling) in the past and they were good producers but I like the gentelness of the Alpines.

Anyway, glad to help you at any time if I can.

Hi thanks alot, Do breeds vary alot in price? How much could i expect to pay for a goat with kid/s at foot? also how long do they producemilk for after having kid/s? thanks Joe

A goat will give milk for 2 yrs, but you must make sure you completely empty her twice a day, i agree with the above about breeds, toggenburg, alpine or saanen, i wouldnt have an anglonubian as tbhheyare not the best temperament, i believe the guernsy is not a brilliant milker, but i think the mlk is creamier, not sure about that though, we used to feed our goats with goat mix, plus a hand full of oats and a handfull of soaked sugar beet pulp , and a sprinkle of bran, and hay, we used to let them have as much hay as they wanted, a mineral lick is good for them, but dont just get the salt one as there are alot of minerals missing in the soil these days, and some deficiencies are bad news, ie copper deficiency could leave your goat loosing her fur and eventually diing if left too long, i would recommend the book called keeping goats.

Breeds - definitely a personal thing! Be sure to check breeds in your home country, as I think there can be a difference. Funny about the British Alpines, as here in NZ, I find what was said above to be just the opposite - long-legged Alpines are fence-jumpers so fences have to be tighter, and I have encountered some which have been very, very mean-spirited goats. We have Toggenburgs predominantly, because they are very laid-back here in NZ, and not at all hard on fences.

You might try going to some shows, depending on how well-attended they are with all the livestock travel restrictions now in place in the UK, but it wold be a good start to have a good look at all the breeds available to you there.

And yes, definitely at least 2 goats, as the herd instinct in goats in general is very strong, and they are not happy alone (and are more likely to find ways of getting into trouble and escaping your fencing if they are alone). And never tether a goat. They too easily get into trouble if on a rope.

In our experience, goats can milk through for 2-3 years without having to have a kid/s each year, and we only milk once a day, in the morning. Milk supply will go way down during the winter, but if you persevere, when the grass starts to grow again in the spring, the milk volume will come right back up again, though not quite to where it was after they had their kid/s.

Best of luck with your search and decision.

Andrea
NZ

Yes, I agree with the other comments about goats milking for 2 years or so after giving birth and that they will drop off in the winter and come back again to bigger production in the spring. Seems it varies a bit, maybe partly because of breed and individual milk production and also circumstances but we also milk once per day with most of the girls and when they slow the odd one I milk every second day. I just keep an eye and see how it is going. I handmilk 8 girls at the moment, although a couple of them are first time Mums and I do not tend to push milk production. We have loads of milk and I could get a lot better production if I milked twice per day (as many people choose to) but for us I find that is enough. Of course the more you milk (take out) the more feed you also need to put in. :D Ours have some lovely forest and natural areas to browse in as well (they love Banksia) and rocks to bounce on. Quite a life really

Cost would vary I am sure from Australia but a registered Alpine doe with a kid at foot (depending on male or female) would sell for between Australian $350 - $500 depending on quality. Mostly they have twins though, so that would change the price again. Saanens are a bit less here I think but a dairy goat already broken in to milk of any breed fetches a fair price.

Interested to hear farmerdrea about your experience with the British Alpines and Toggenburgs. It is interesting that the breeds seem to have developed quite differently in different countries. We actually have some NZ British Alpines purchased through a stud here that imported embryos some time ago from a closed heard in NZ and they are completely different to the ones developed here in Australia. This was a direct British line so that might be different as well. There has been a push here to judge them differently in the show circuit for that reason. I run both types here at the moment as well as a cross between the two (still registered but interesting differences). My observations so far - This NZ lines are a smaller, goat, produce less milk while younger but the very big plus is that they produce more milk over their lifetime, they produce for more years than their Australian counterparts who are a much taller goat. They, being quite a bit smaller, also require less hard feed to produce the equal amount of milk. I have found them to be very quiet and perhaps better on fences then their Australian Counterparts. Have to say though, in appearance and character I do love the Toggenburgs, they are really a beautiful goat. Love to hear more about your Toggenburgs and experiences as well.

Good luck with your goats - I think they are really wonderful animals.

Toggenburgs are nice. We milked twice a day as their udders got overfull if left overnight. We milked at feed time & perhaps we were overdoing it but we got the milk & the goats were comfortable. We were told that they were more likely to get mastitis if milked only once a day. These goats were yielding 6-8 pints per day though.

We milk our girls once a day, as I mentioned, and they do fine with it. We haven't had mastitis yet, though perhaps we've just been lucky? We get 6-9 pints a day from our girls (though I measure in liters, so I get 2.5-4 liters a day). Most girls have their kids left on, though, so the kids have milk during the day, does get locked away from kids overnight, and then we milk in the morning. Still, our 2 highest producing girls don't have kids on, and only get milked once a day. One does 4.5 liters a day, and the other 3 liters a day (she's a miniature goat, so 3 liters is high-producing for her).

Cheers
Andrea
NZ

Anyone keeps goats around the Nottingham/Derby area? Would love to come and see how yours are kept. thanks alot Joe

Hi, Mauzi -- yes, I love my Toggies. I don't know what it is about their character. I think they're probably the most laid-back of the breeds I have, though individual characters in each breed are different to the main one. I have Toggs, Saanens, Nubians, Arapawas and Rawhitis. The last two we're breeding for conservation at this point, because they're rare breeds, but there are some reasonable milkers in there.

I'm only milking 9 girls this season, as I lost half my milking herd with barbers' pole worms and campylobacter last summer. Next season, I'll be milking this years' R2 does, so will be back up to about 20 goats a day, at least till I see how their udders and production are. I'll probably be taking about 6 does right through for a couple of years, which was my intention last summer, but then with the health problems, and goats dropping like flies, I dried them all off rather than tax them further.

Seems I've hijacked the thread - sorry! Back to the original question!

Sheds of some kind are very important, as goats don't carry body fat like sheep, nor do they have lanolin as a natural water barrier, as do sheep. We know when it's going to rain shortly, as all the goats will hoof it into the sheds about 5 minutes before it's due to start pouring, but in a fine rain, they will venture back out and keep grazing in it.

Minerals are also important for goats, and we always have a loose lick, formulated for goats specifically, out for them to take when they need it. They need much more copper than is safe for sheep, because they metabolize it differently.

Also, depending on the goat and what she/he has to walk on, they will regularly need their hooves trimmed. Some of mine need it as often as twice a MONTH (VERY bad start for a couple of my goats, and it shows in their feet, poor girls), and the rare breeds only need it about every 8 months. With 70 goats, I do a few feet a week, whether it's trimming or checking, and that way I can keep on top of it.

If I had a small number of goats, or had more land for them to use, I would probably not use chemicals for dealing with parasites. Even as it is, I don't use a regular drenching program (the only regularity is drenching newly kidded does within a day of kidding, as the stress on the body can mean party time for the worms!), but keep a watchful eye on everyone, looking for scours, anemia and low/slow goats. When you get to know your stock, which you will learn over time, it becomes quite easy to pick out a poorly one from a large group. Drench resistance is becoming a very large problem everywhere. You can use rotational grazing to rest paddocks and discourage parasites, as well as all kinds of medicinal herbs to deal with goats.

The herd as a whole has access to grazing daily, as well as hay each evening. The milking does get fed a mixture of soaked beet pulp (non-molasses variety), broll, rolled barley and maize, with a pinch of seaweed meal and apple cider vinegar every few days. Each girl gets about 2 liters of the mixture, which I make up myself, not having access to any feeds for goats where we are.

That's about all I can think of at the moment... must be off to milk to goats!

Cheers
Andrea
NZ

farmercoop wrote:<B>Hi All, I Have already got Kunekune pigs,chickens,ducks and geese and have been looking at a couple of dairy goats for a while, obviously id have to get two for company so say a nanny in kid would be okay because as soon as she gave birth she would have the kids for company? would that work? or a nanny with kid at foot? would that work? And are these often available? Just wondering if anyone can supply me with some information on dairy goats, particularly like golden gurnseys, any information at all would be greatly appreciated even if its down to how many pound of food or something they eat a day. thanks Joe </b>

in kid nanny is a good idea, however, the problem arises if she only has one kid and it's a billy or has 2 and they are both billy kids, when you put them in the freezer, she will be alone again. Ideally you would have 2 nannys, and each one goes turn and turnabout at kidding so you always have plenty of milk. As for food, they are browsers not grazers so if you have suitable trees and shrubs to cut and hang up it's great, otherwise plenty of good hay. Only a small part of the diet should be concentrate. Include things like cabbage (not too much as it taints the milk), chopped carrots, chopped fresh sugar beet or turnips and swedes. I never gave parsnips, a/ mine didn't like them, not one goat in 15 years keeping goats ever ate parsnips, and b/ they cause blistering inside the mouth which could be mistaken for F&M.
They will also eat barley straw, and grass nuts and sugar beet pulp nuts which although you are supposed to be able to give them unsoaked to goats, I always used to soak them just in case.
My own breed of choice is british Saanen. Good milking strains will be able to feed a kid plus give around 6 pints per day for the house. Perhaps even a crossbreed might suit? Saanen X boer for example to produce meat billys. I always found my BS to be docile and friendly. The one time I had a golden Geurnsey it was as mad as a hatter, kept escaping and eventually got out onto the road and was killed by a car.. BritishToggenburgs and Alpines are also nice friendly easy to manage goats.English goats are pretty but don't stay in milk for as long, Anglo Nubians gorgeous huge goats which come in a fantastic range of colours and markings but are noisy and more lively that the rest, Boers, make good meat animals but not much use for milking hence the crosses.
Feel free to email me if you want. Have you been to the goat society website? There are lots of pictures and descriptions and links to breeders and clubs.
I'm about to take delivery of one English, one British Saanen and one British alpine females and a British Saanen 8 months old billy.

Have pmed you

gee it is great to see so many goat breeders around. I often feel a bit on my own over here. :D

Good luck with your goats farmercoop - seems there is lots of support here for you to get some help.

farmerdrea - you must be a very busy person We had a bit of trouble with Barbers pole this year as well - lost 2 and saved 2. Do you keep the goats as a commercial venture?

sonymee - do you still keep goats.

Cheers
Mauzi