Arid/Desert food

[Mum_Greenwood]

Apart from spearing things, I am wanting more knowledge on arid and/or desert area food plants. People live on it, in parts of the globe, without modern technology and some how get by.

Due to the high price of housing here, I am will most likely have to move to a drier part of this country. This makes it harder for a self-sufficient type like me. Instead of the way most people do it, by trying to make the land and surroundings adapt to them, I am just going to go with it and live with what is there. Trying to grow things that will survive without draining the town water supplies. (or empty the tank water).

This area gets some high temps in Summer (can get up to 50degreesC) and low temps, but little rain in the winter.

I want to know what kinds of food can be grown in such a dry, virtually, waterless environment. I have read about Amaranth, Prickly Pear, Salt Bush (but not sure which part you can eat). I know which weeds are edible, but you can only eat so much, sow thistle, cleevers and dandelion etc., before you go banana's. Don't think too many mushrooms would grow there, so they are out.

Me

[andyt]

Strewth mum, thats a difficult one for us in soggy old U.K. Any chance for you to save your 'grey' water?

[Mum_Greenwood]

Water is soooo scarce, that they have to bring it in to fill water tanks lol. So grey water, may not always be an option lol. I have even used bath water (and a bucket full of water, just for washing hands) to wash clothes (then dry in the sun). Then the water might be too soapy for the garden??

I would move to the UK, but english/irish heritage is 3 generations ago. Not an option.

[Clara]

Water is soooo scarce, that they have to bring it in to fill water tanks lol. So grey water, may not always be an option lol. I have even used bath water (and a bucket full of water, just for washing hands) to wash clothes (then dry in the sun). Then the water might be too soapy for the garden??

I would move to the UK, but english/irish heritage is 3 generations ago. Not an option.

I wouldn´t live anywhere the water had to be trucked in....not only does that sound horrendous for the environment, but it makes you VERY vulnerable.....you need water to survive......whoever is making the deliveries has got you by the balls, pricewise. With the cost of fuel (for the trucks) rising (and the fuel itself running out), you could end up with a piece of land which seemed like a bargain at the time but ends both financially and agriculturally worthless.

Could you find somewhere smaller and less brittle?

Clara x

[Mum_Greenwood]

Not unless someone wants to give me $100,000. Because of the price of housing here, I have been forced into an area with high unemployment. This means that the house that I currently have, has little value and leaves me little choice but to move somewhere where rainfall is low or to a place in Tasmania (where rainfall is good) where there is nothing to do (I have a 15yo daughter), and the people are either rednecks or miners.( or a bit of both).

At least the dry place has things to entertain the 15yo.

Because I can't afford to live in a place where there is a better chance of a job, (or to commute because of the high price of fuel here), I can't get a loan for a mortgage either. So my choices are limited. Very limited.

I would prefer to get a bush block and just live in something similar to a yurt. (have my design in mind- years of research). I have done something similar years ago. But most councils wouldn't approve, and I'm sure that child protection wouldn't either. Child protection bugged a friend of mine about 10years ago for living in a Tipi type thing with her daughters.

My other love would be to build my own house. My experience with this, is mostly in theory. When I have signed up to do a course, it gets cancelled due to lack of numbers.

I have 3/4 of the experience that I need to make shipping containers into a home (if you google them, there are many more aesthetically pleasing designs- to please councils). I can use most power tools and know how to insulate them. The only thing stopping me, is that I can't use a welder. Most of the courses run late into the evening and are too far from where I live. One course provider told me (even in this day and age) that women aren't fit to do the course.

Can't find anyone who will just teach me (that information constipation thing). I can use every other tool that is needed except for a welder. I can install cabinets and bathrooms. But, to make door and window frames in a shipping container, you need to weld. Can put a fitted out shipping container house together for $20,000. (It would be bigger than what I have now- but I don't need a huge house).

I think houses were one of the worst inventions, that only compel people to use chemicals to clean them (I don't use chemicals) and fill them with pretty junk made in china. But, when you have kids, in this day and age, you have to live in four walls. (government rules).

Unless I live in an eco-community or am indigenous (I belong in neither category) I can't live in a tent/yurt/tent/geodesic tent. I have researched communities, but the ones where people live in accommodation alternatives, get filled up quickly, the others (that are supposedly eco-friendly) are too expensive. The lack of funds thing again.

I would start up a community, but again, I haven't the money and can't find others who want to start one (have advertised many times over the years in the "green living" mags here in Oz). I got letters like "don't bother it's too hard" or " join ours, but you have to hand over $000000 to live here". I got no helpful info or feedback from interested parties.

I currently live in an area, where we are in drought. I am in a rainforest area, but it hasn't rained for a couple of weeks, and then, it wasn't a good rainfall (for winter). I have to move, for reasons, that I am not going to share at this stage, but yes, I do have to move.

That's the short version........

[Clara]

Please don´t take what I said the wrong way.....I was just trying to raise the issue that water is VITAL and having to rely on someone else and someone elses transport for it, makes you vulnerable. When I came to decide where to settle, access to water was the one thing I would not negotiate on......everything else can be worked around with either ingenuity or money (when it is available).

I can tell you are in very tricky position....I´m frankly horrified that soc serv would give you hassle for living in alternative accomodation. I think you should get on a plane and head for Spain! How you live is your own business here, particularly as a foreigner. I know people with many kids living in tipis and yurts etc.

Obviously you are trying to put your daughter first, who wouldn´t, but if you are looking for the long term perhaps you should consider the fact that in a few years (and given that she is a girl probably fewer than if she were a boy), she will want to go and do her own thing anyway. Is there an interim measure that would mean you could meet both of your needs for the next wee while (and you can get on to cracking that information constipation ), and then head to somewhere more agreeable to agriculture when she flies the nest?

How about a long term wwoof?

[contadino]

Even supposed drought-tolerant crops need water. If you have very little rainfall, it doesn't mean it's uninhabitable. It means you have to plan your water situation a bit better.

For example, I've read about people in the UK watering their veg patches from 200ltr water tanks. That's nearly half of what I use for irrigation each day, so obviously a 200ltr capacity rainwater system is no use to me. My tank is nearly 100,000ltrs, and the catchment area is my roof & the large patio in front of the house. The tank is sized to meet my demand, and the catchment area is sized based on the annual rainfall. So maybe you need to install a massive tank, and capture rain from an even larger area.

Permaculture has some great techniques for maintaining water in the soil, and reusing grey water efficiently.

Beware crops claimed to be drought-tolerant. They're not when you're talking about 40-odd degrees for more than a couple of weeks. Last year the Prickly Pears here were slumped on the floor before the rains came in September. Amaranths will be tinder way before then.

Personally, as long as you know you'll get some rain each year, IMHO it's worth considering. If the prospect of no rain for 12 months exists, forget it.

[Hedgehogpie]

You could try doing a search for Australian wild food plants to get you started. I found these books for example, maybe you can source them through a library?

Wild Food in Australia - AB Cribb

Wild Food Plants of Australia - Tim Low

Bush Tucker: Australia's Wild Food Harvest - Tim Low

Wild Lime: Cooking from the Bush Food Garden - Juleigh Robins, Rhys Freeman

Another place to try could be the Association of Societies for Growing Australian Plants: http://asgap.org.au/

I'm UK based so I can't suggest much more - sorry. Good luck with your search though.

[Hedgehogpie]

I found these two snippets about indiginous food plants as well - maybe of some use?

http://www.users.on.net/~wayne_r/Aborig ... plants.htm

Http://www.teachers.ash.org.au/bushtucker/index.html

After checking out native plants, you could try looking for food plants from other desert/arid regions of the world, although I imagine getting hold of specimens won't necessarily be particularly easy or cheap.

[Mum_Greenwood]

This is the driest continent on earth, according to the stat's and because people keep trying to farm like Europeans (not insulting Europeans, I am half European) they are making our desert area's expand. I figured, it's learn to live how we are supposed to, here, or die out. The way things are going, we are fast becoming completely dry. Most town water supplies are low or completely dried up.

Instead of going with the idea (that so many have here) that we can keep making the earth conform to our needs, I want to listen to what the Earth wants. Or at the least, learn how the middle eastern people/african tribal people live.

There is a book called "Back from the brink". It's written by a farmer, who has decided to listen to the Earth and he is busily trying to get others to farm the way he does. He took 100's of acres, that had a dried up creek through it and made it green again and the creek is full all year round. (I still don't think large scale farms are a good idea- but like his methods). All the other properties, around his, are brown and dry. His is lush and green. If I had 100's of acres, I would regenerate it the way he did. (If I won the lotto, imagine how much I could regenerate?!)

I have been researching, cultures/communities who live in drier parts of the globe, with not much luck. May have to buy a book. I would be quiet happy to just be nomadic. It's better for the earth to allow things to regenerate. (and keep trees on it- but I am preaching to the converted lol).

I have looked into "bushtucker" plants, the good ones are hard to come by. May call up, the aboriginal communities and ask them for advice.

Time to make breakfast for everyone..........thanks for your feedback guys.

[Hedgehogpie]

I agree. it's one of the reasons why I love foraging so much, I think it's far more respectful and sustainable in so many ways.

Good luck with your quest.

[Ellendra]

Might look into chia as well, its a desert food plant. The seeds and sprouts are both edible. The seeds have as much omega-3 as flax seeds, but they're more easily digested.

You've already mentioned prickly pears, both the fruit and young pads are edible.

There are some trees that are well adapted to desert areas, but I don't have my list of neat plants anymore (laptop troubles).