Emptying the supermarket shelves

[Skippy]

That lack of delivery slots or the putting back of deliveries to me makes the actions of those panic buyers seem somewhat more understandable. GA says non for days , the food programme on radio 4 was talking about 10 day delays and a poster on another forum i use mentioned a two week delay to her part of the highlands. And this is while we have relatively few cases. Then the government says we'll be able to supply those who have to self isolate and understandably people just don't believe that and think they'll be on their own. To pinch a quote i read elsewhere "evolution favours species that do what works rather than species that do the 'right' thing".

[Viper254]

I think it's a "confidence" thing. The Government say the supply chain is up to it to ease panic buying, regardless of whether the supply chain is actually up to it - but what's the alternative?

[ina]

And as always, it's the ones at the bottom of the food chain that suffer most. Food banks are running out of goods, and can't even buy in to make up for lack of donations, because the supermarkets are empty. Even those who don't normally need food banks, but just have enough money every month to make ends meet, now can't get the cheap stuff they have to rely on... I can see rationing coming in again if this keeps on!

[Skippy]

I've my doubts that rationing would be brought back or even if it could. It certainly wouldn't be a vote winner but i've said before that it would make perfectly good sense. It makes a level playing field irrespective of one's wealth . There'd probably be a bit of a black market but on the whole it would probably all work out.

[Weedo]

GA - I am certain now the Northern nettles are a different species to the Oz ones; ours never reach even half this height, branch much more and have smaller. narrower leaves- ergo shorter fibres. Worth a go though. I will try this method with the Sunn Hemp as it grows to 1.5 - 2 metres

I have heard an explanation regarding the disappearing toilet paper et. al. Apparently the Chinese factories were ordered to reduce toilet paper production and concentrate on face masks (prioritisation) - the Chinese then panic bought up toilet paper and the rest of the world trailed along. We even import Chinese stupidity.

[Green Aura]

It reminds me of early Soviet policies - shortage of screws turn all the factories to screw production, leading to shortage of something else.
Possibly not stupidity, if you know production of TP has more or less ceased, more get it while you can.
The rest of the world following? Folks will panic at anything and lack of coherent communication from authority figures doesn't help.

[ina]

There's a video on BBC about the production of loo rolls in the UK - of course they say not to panic, there's plenty coming up etc - but the material for it is sourced in South America and Scandinavia. So no guarantee that will continue to be available, is there!? And why don't they use British recycled paper for it?

[Green Aura]

And why don't they use British recycled paper for it?

Hopefully things have changed for the better now, but I remember having this same conversation with two tutors on my MSc Environmental Protection course, many moons ago.

One tutor was adamant that using recycled TP was not a great idea as production was concentrated in very few facilities and transport to and from these outweighed any good that came of recycling. The other insisted that it must be the way to go, because it was important to get the public at large used to the idea of using recycled materials (not just loo rolls) and supply would follow demand.

I figured if they couldn't decide which was better I'd stop worrying so much, so I contine to buy it but don't worry if I can't.

The current situation, however, might help decide the issue if imports dry up.

[ina]

One tutor was adamant that using recycled TP was not a great idea as production was concentrated in very few facilities and transport to and from these outweighed any good that came of recycling.

I somehow can't imagine that it is better for the environment to import new stuff from halfway around the world than transporting recycled material across maybe a quarter of the UK... Where I last lived in Germany, loo rolls were produced locally. Back then, paper wasn't generally recycled; local charities went round town once a month and collected old paper from households. That way they earned a bit of money for their charity, and the papermill got a steady supply of material. No doubt they also got some from elsewhere. I think the problem is at least partly the general centralisation of everything.

[Viper254]

Yes. After all this is over, I can see supply chains being analysed in a very different light...

[ina]

Let's hope so!

[Weedo]

One of the reasons for slow take-up of "green" technology (recycled products, solar etc.) is the cost of research, development and marketing exceed the potential return; the "market" for these things is still relatively small. I would suggest that this is an area for our leaders to introduce some regulation. Example, the Millenium Ghettos being built around us at the moment have no rainwater capture (even for loos and garden use - tanks can be built underground so don't take up space) no recycled water capacity (not even plumbed for it in the future) and about 1 in 50 houses have solar of any type.

If rainwater tanks, solar (for house and feeding excess into grid) recycled / renewable products (loo paper - insulation etc.), double glazing (we don't have anyone that produces double glazed windows in Wagga (pop 65k) and waste water recycling (councils) were mandated then industry will rise to meet the need. This has been seen in other instances - mandated bicycles helmets saw development of dozens of cheaper, lightweight, highly effective products within 12 months; mandated house insulation saw the rise of several new cheaper and more effective products; mandated water restrictions has changed the types of plants available and the uptake of water efficient products.

[Flo]

It's an interesting situation that it isn't just the supermarket shelves that are suffering. A couple of the big on-line suppliers in the UK - Riverford Veg has stopped taking on any more customers to have veg delivered or extra orders from the old hands so that their long serving regulars still get their veg boxes delivered and Suma Wholefood who deliver specialist eco type food and cleaning to businesses first and then to small home groups known as food co-ops have stopped taking orders from any of the long standing customers till they can get themselves together again - never mind new customers. Our local small food co-op was warned last week that we would be a long way down the delivery chain even if we did order. Things were brewing with the last order that we had when items were suddenly not available when the pickers came to pack our order for delivery. And that was only some 6 weeks ago. Before things became "interesting".

[Green Aura]

The small independent businesses, particularly of a more social aspect are going to fare very badly through this too.

On a brighter note, one of these - a vegan cafe, is offering 3 meals a day, for £35/week, delivered daily to the door (locally, of course). Fairly simple food - porridge, soup for lunch then dinner (stew) and pud (looked like a slice of cake). But a fiver a day for 3 meals isn't too bad, I think, and it seems to me it serves various other purposes too. The obvious, bringing food to the vulnerable who can't get out, keeps the cafe open, staff and some drivers in work, with minimal person contact, but also ensures someone is able to keep even a cursory eye on the said vulnerable folks they're serving.

[ina]

I think quite a few cafes/restaurant might go down the home delivery route. I'm trying to point out to all and sundry that this is the year they should start growing food in their gardens... Will the British really take on the farm jobs in summer, harvesting our fruit and veg? Maybe, once they've lost their current jobs and the situation gets desperate enough...