The UK is in Recesssion

[Andy Hamilton]

Ok so it was announced that the UK is in Recession as of today.

Now we all know that this will be good for the environment as less people will fly, construction on green belt land should hopefully cease (as construction ceases) and people will be looking for cheaper and therefore more energy efficient ways of powering and heating their homes. We could also see people opting to grow their own more and making do and mending.

On the downside fairtrade will no doubt take a bashing, so will organic food and there will be less money in communty pots for eco projects.

But is life any different? As a writer we never have any work anyway so there won't be much difference. In fact reading is a pretty cheap form of entertainment when you think about it.

[Milims]

We aren't that well off but we still manage to buy good food - organic fair trade etc. I think it's a matter of priorities. I'd rather spend what little money I have on decent products than on going out for the night. I've also noticed that since I've been more careful about the quality of the products I buy I'm actually spending less! So in truth - recession or not I don't think it will have that much effect on us - when you've got nowt you use it better!

[MikeM]

we'll see an increase in crime and probably civil unrest. We'll also see an increased interest in cheap forms of energy, i.e. coal and so on. They'll also be an increase in lower standards in animal farming as people demand cheap food.

[Millymollymandy]

Thought it had been in recession for quite a while. Yes it affects us because we have savings in the Uk which are now receiving practically nothing in interest which is still taxable in France.

For the first time since I moved here 12 years ago we're now getting considerably more interest in the banks here in France (gross!) but we can't transfer Sterling over here because of the naff exchange rates.

Also our savings plans and personal pensions have gone down considerably, but hopefully by the time we retire things should have gone up again.

Life in France carries on the same as normal except for the rise in prices. Had to buy a new mattress and we were told that mattresses had doubled in price in the last year due to the rise in oil prices. As our bed is two singles fixed together ( couldn't get a king size up our stairs) my husband's side of the bed is costing over €600 for a replacement single mattress, and this is after only 4 years as his is now trashed. Can't afford that kind of thing every 4 years.

[Clara]

...my husband's side of the bed is costing over €600 for a replacement single mattress, and this is after only 4 years as his is now trashed....

Oh?

[Millymollymandy]

Not what you're thinking Clara - go wash you mouth out with soap young lady!

Anyway a mattress should take such things into account.

The problem with France is that a firm mattress in France is a medium in the UK, and he needs a proper firm for his weight. My side is fine because it is just right for my 9 ish stone but he weighs a lot more, and has been suffering dreadful back and hip pain lately from it. Anyway new one is arriving Friday next week!

[bodrighy]

Have you tried putting a board under the 'medium' matthress. Works for me.

Recession tends to be worse for those who have something to lose. Personally I rent my house, live day to day with few savings and (at present) no job to lose as I was made redundant last July. I'm one of the lucky ones. I have a loving family all living close by and a wife who has the same attitude as me. We already shop at charity shops and boot sales, because we prefer to, not just because we have to and we do weird things like make our own pies, cakes, jams, wine etc. Being skint isn't as bad as it's made out to be. Losing something is hard, not having it in the first place isn't.

Pete

[Green Aura]

There is one downside to it - I can't sell my house!

So we look really affluent, with our two houses, but we're only just keeping our heads above water. It's not like we even want the house in Manchester any more - just can't get rid of it!

We did toy with just giving it back to the building society, but they'll sell quickly and cheap and we'd probably still be left with a huge debt and no house to show for it. But we're lucky, we can manage, and we'll hopefully ride it out.

It just means OH has to carry on working full-time for a while - good thing he's a workaholic. At least he works from home now.

[red]

There is one downside to it - I can't sell my house!

.

can you rent it out?

[red]

But is life any different? .

i suspect it will create a lot of differences yes. even if it does not hit you directly, there will others.. shops and businesses you use, comunity projects etc

[The Riff-Raff Element]

But is life any different? .

i suspect it will create a lot of differences yes. even if it does not hit you directly, there will others.. shops and businesses you use, comunity projects etc

What strikes me most about this recession is that it is being so comprehensively documented, courtesy of the WWW. There has never been a collection of information or of experinces on such a staggering scale.

Whether this will make a difference when it comes to policing the financial services industry and setting policy in the future I cannot say, but it might.

I think it will make a difference to people's attitude to enviromental issues, and for the better. Firstly, there is a very clear understanding of how greed and over-consumption lead to this particular crisis (which does differentiate it from previous slumps); secondly that there simply are not the resources available to us - be they of energy or of minerals - to continue as we have done before. Thirdly, the run up of energy prices that preceded to crash allowed a lot of technologies to come of age; solar heating and electricity, heat pumps and the means of energy conservation all developed rapidly over the past decade and have become an economic choice as well as a life style one.

[Clara]

...Firstly, there is a very clear understanding of how greed and over-consumption lead to this particular crisis (which does differentiate it from previous slumps)....

On the one hand this is true but, and this is where I just get baffled by economics, all the "stimulus" packages seem to be aimed at getting people to spend and banks to give credit again. What gives?

[Graye]

MillyMollyMandy can I tell you a devious plan to get things from the UK if they are much cheaper there or hard to find overseas? We've done it several times. We order online (for instance a mattress from a reputable firm who do next day delivery, have lots of brands and firmnesses (is that a word?) take cards online, etc.)

Before we actually order I contact a removal firm (we use one in Ripon but there are lots of independent ones who do runs up and down France and Spain) and find out when their next trip is with some space on the lorry and to a point near us. Then I order the mattress for delivery to their depot the day before they plan to leave. They drop off the goods, usual cost around 70 pounds, I cook the guys a meal and let them use the shower and everyone is happy! The good quality mattress we bought (a double) cost us under 300 pounds including the delivery, I knew exactly what we were getting, etc. Not much use since you've just ordered one but should you need another in 4 years time just let me know and I'll give you the various contact info. Friends have bought such diverse things as a garden shed, a Rayburn and a greenhouse by the same method!

As for the recession, I agree it's a pain for anyone tied in any way to the pound. I understand their are charities being set up in southern Spain to assist pensioners who have suddenly "lost" up to 40% of their income. As far as I can see for people in the UK there are plusses and minuses and I wouldn't like to be person to decide which way that balance goes.

[The Riff-Raff Element]

...Firstly, there is a very clear understanding of how greed and over-consumption lead to this particular crisis (which does differentiate it from previous slumps)....

On the one hand this is true but, and this is where I just get baffled by economics, all the "stimulus" packages seem to be aimed at getting people to spend and banks to give credit again. What gives?

Panic.

But in some economies that is starting to subside and is giving way to more structured programs - public works and so forth. The culture of UK economic management - arisng from the Thatcher years - is to provide stimulus, as you say, by providing the "market" with cheap, accessable credit and allowing the "market" to decide how to spend it.

They will get past this when they can no longer cut interest rates (only 1% to go!) just as the US is in the process of doing. The action of stimualting the economy by directly providing employment through govt agency is based on the philosophy of John Maynard Keynes who you may have heard getting a lot of stick in the past couple of decades for being a bit of a leftie and "anti-market" but people are dusting off his works now.

Rosevelt's "New Deal" in the US in the 1930's was essentially based on these principles.

[ajs88]

i think that people will hold off from big purchase's, but will continue too and maybe even increase the amount of cheap things from hearing some of the girls at work 'i have to buy something every weekend, even if its just a necklace from primark, cheer myself up'

i think most will give up organic, fair-trade and quality before giving up quantity

reducing consumption is more about being happy with life, getting a 'buzz' out of succesfuly making maramalade or growing something, rather then from buying something.